SCOTUS to overturn Roe v Wade

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StillwaterTownie

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I just want to emphasize that question specifically addressed minors as well and he still stuck to his "no exceptions" as did Shannon...

Telling your 16yo daughter who got raped and pregnant "sorry honey, you're gonna just have to be strong and have this baby" should not be required by law but neither of these two seemed to have any issue with that.
If Oklahoma women are frightened and outraged enough by Mullin and Stitt on their highly prohibitive stands on abortion, then they will decide the outcome of those races, meaning Mullin and Stitt will lose. Further interesting that both of their opponents are women.
 
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If Oklahoma women are frightened and outraged enough by Mullin and Stitt on their highly prohibitive stands on abortion, then they will decide the outcome of those races, meaning Mullin and Stitt will lose. Further interesting that both of their opponents are women.
Should be really interesting for Stitt because outside of the few metros, which I might add still captures a lot of anti-abortion women, is also a huge block of rural, devout Christian voters. However, he's still pissed off a pretty big block of other voters regarding education and tribal issues. I honestly don't know which way either of the Senate and Governor races will land.
 
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Should be really interesting for Stitt because outside of the few metros, which I might add still captures a lot of anti-abortion women, is also a huge block of rural, devout Christian voters. However, he's still pissed off a pretty big block of other voters regarding education and tribal issues. I honestly don't know which way either of the Senate and Governor races will land.
Republican incumbency. How it's ended just about every time for nearly 20 years.
 

andylicious

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I bring up public opinion, cuz it 'should' mean something to our elected officials...you say the US isn't a democracy...I'm assuming you mean it is labeled as such, but doesn't act like it is????....The United States is a representative democracy. This means that our government is elected by citizens. Here, citizens vote for their government officials. These officials represent the citizens' ideas and concerns in government. (taken from uscis)....and I understand SCOTUS should not take public opinion/polls into account, but they do take their political ideals into their decisions...
That's called a republic
 
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steross

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An interesting read that distills a lot of the current issues in maternal mortality and with relevance for abortion.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/feat...orsens-as-maternity-wards-close?sref=VLsP8x9g
This is a very good article but is long and I suspect that many won't read it. But, a couple of key passages are not about abortion but our health care. Sadly, for many things, It isn't the best like we claim. Not even close.

For every 100,000 women who give birth in Germany, fewer than 4 die. In Canada, the figure is 8; in the UK, a bit fewer than 9. In the US, the number is 24. In 2020, 861 women died because of pregnancy or childbirth. That may not sound like a lot, but according to the National Academies of Sciences, Engineering, and Medicine, for every death, an estimated 70 other women barely survive. This means that in 2020, an additional 60,270 women in the US suffered life-threatening medical complications, many of which could’ve been prevented if they’d had better access to care. Ranked against other countries by the World Bank, the quality of maternal health care in America is no better than in Latvia, Moldova, and Oman.
It wasn’t always this way. Forty years ago, America’s maternal mortality rate was 7.5, better than in many European countries at the time. But while childbirth has gotten safer there, today the US is the most dangerous wealthy country in which to give birth.
 
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This is a very good article but is long and I suspect that many won't read it. But, a couple of key passages are not about abortion but our health care. Sadly, for many things, It isn't the best like we claim. Not even close.

For every 100,000 women who give birth in Germany, fewer than 4 die. In Canada, the figure is 8; in the UK, a bit fewer than 9. In the US, the number is 24. In 2020, 861 women died because of pregnancy or childbirth. That may not sound like a lot, but according to the National Academies of Sciences, Engineering, and Medicine, for every death, an estimated 70 other women barely survive. This means that in 2020, an additional 60,270 women in the US suffered life-threatening medical complications, many of which could’ve been prevented if they’d had better access to care. Ranked against other countries by the World Bank, the quality of maternal health care in America is no better than in Latvia, Moldova, and Oman.
It wasn’t always this way. Forty years ago, America’s maternal mortality rate was 7.5, better than in many European countries at the time. But while childbirth has gotten safer there, today the US is the most dangerous wealthy country in which to give birth.
As soon as I posted it, I figured you and maybe one other person might actually read it.

Another interesting stat was about the rural/urban divide. That mortality rate is 18 in urban areas and 29 in rural places. That tells us that the rurality highlighted here is a huge issue. It also tells us that urban areas have a substantial distance to make up to catch other advanced economies. California is one of our best states for maternal death and it still had a rate of 12.8 in 2019, which was its best rate in 5 years. I will be very curious to see how covid burnout affects this. Unfortunately, I see little room for optimism.

Edit: for some levity on issues in rural medicine: https://youtu.be/ERNAqqNSId0
 
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An interesting read that distills a lot of the current issues in maternal mortality and with relevance for abortion.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/feat...orsens-as-maternity-wards-close?sref=VLsP8x9g
That was very sobering to read. And what is scary is that things seem to be going in the wrong direction with so many of our medical personnel hitting retiring age, retiring early, leaving the industry, or moving abroad to practice. Not to mention the mental health issues many in the industry are suffering from after what they went through with Covid. Clearly something is broken here.
 

steross

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That was very sobering to read. And what is scary is that things seem to be going in the wrong direction with so many of our medical personnel hitting retiring age, retiring early, leaving the industry, or moving abroad to practice. Not to mention the mental health issues many in the industry are suffering from after what they went through with Covid. Clearly something is broken here.
I now work at the VA. Going to the VA was always something in the back of my mind as I am a veteran and like the population. But, lower pay and frustrating bureaucracy has always held boarded ER docs like myself away from the VA. It was looked at as a job that people who could not keep/get better jobs did in my specialty.
The VA typically had non-ER doctors working the ER as they simply could not obtain them.

That has all changed. I have to be on my best behavior as there are currently 15 docs who have applied and want my position if I were to leave. Medicine in the US, particularly in hospital/corporate-run specialties, is an absolute hell-hole. Docs are retiring early/finding other jobs because the job is intolerable. It will stay intolerable as long as there is an intense desire for as much profit as possible from the industry. We are their enemy. We are nothing more than an excessive cost to them. They use our desire to treat patients against us. They use the rules of supervision against us. They use the government against us.

Here is a fresh example of that. Build Back Better has medicare cuts. But, the cuts are targeted.

Impact is particularly pronounced in the physician setting for all specialties, which would see a 44.2% cut versus 36% in the hospital outpatient departments.

So, if you are a private practice oncologist and the payment you get from Medicare is cut a huge amount and 8% more than the hospital-based oncologist. How long are you going to survive? It sucks working in corporate med and the government is basically forcing corporate med.

https://avalere.com/insights/part-b...2-YI6PLBaNMWJ-oIBJ73my_seenZCjcMGcRlnp05AwOoE
 
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I now work at the VA. Going to the VA was always something in the back of my mind as I am a veteran and like the population. But, lower pay and frustrating bureaucracy has always held boarded ER docs like myself away from the VA. It was looked at as a job that people who could not keep/get better jobs did in my specialty.
The VA typically had non-ER doctors working the ER as they simply could not obtain them.

That has all changed. I have to be on my best behavior as there are currently 15 docs who have applied and want my position if I were to leave. Medicine in the US, particularly in hospital/corporate-run specialties, is an absolute hell-hole. Docs are retiring early/finding other jobs because the job is intolerable. It will stay intolerable as long as there is an intense desire for as much profit as possible from the industry. We are their enemy. We are nothing more than an excessive cost to them. They use our desire to treat patients against us. They use the rules of supervision against us. They use the government against us.

Here is a fresh example of that. Build Back Better has medicare cuts. But, the cuts are targeted.

Impact is particularly pronounced in the physician setting for all specialties, which would see a 44.2% cut versus 36% in the hospital outpatient departments.

So, if you are a private practice oncologist and the payment you get from Medicare is cut a huge amount and 8% more than the hospital-based oncologist. How long are you going to survive? It sucks working in corporate med and the government is basically forcing corporate med.

https://avalere.com/insights/part-b...2-YI6PLBaNMWJ-oIBJ73my_seenZCjcMGcRlnp05AwOoE
I rotated for six months at the VA and had several friends who wound up working there. It's hands down the best work life balance of any system. It's also insanely rigid and the one I worked in definitely had that government austerity feel to it. In my field, it's been a highly appealing place for at least a decade with some of the best clinicians I've ever worked with. I'd take VA documentation and red tape over medicaid any day.

I know I posted this guy earlier, but came across another video of his that seemed appropriate here.

 

StillwaterTownie

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Stitt will win and it won't be close. That's how Oklahoma is these days. Recent polling backs that up. Basically every undecided voter would have to swing the other way for Stitt to lose.

https://www.amberintegrated.com/new...upcoming-2022-primary-and-general-elections-1
So, a lot of people did not correctly predict the outcome of the Kansas election to keep abortion rights in the state constitution. Some thought it would be very close. More horror stories about what happened to females who can't get abortions when needed will increase the likelihood that Stitt will lose. Oklahoma Democrats are not the radical extremists.
 
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So, a lot of people did not correctly predict the outcome of the Kansas election to keep abortion rights in the state constitution. Some thought it would be very close. More horror stories about what happened to females who can't get abortions when needed will increase the likelihood that Stitt will lose. Oklahoma Democrats are not the radical extremists.
I'd love for you to be right. Kansas is not Oklahoma (go look up any federal election map from the last 16 years) and it won't be as simple as Kansas abortion laws where people effectively voted to keep things as they are. Voting out Republicans would represent change.
 

StillwaterTownie

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I'd love for you to be right. Kansas is not Oklahoma (go look up any federal election map from the last 16 years) and it won't be as simple as Kansas abortion laws where people effectively voted to keep things as they are. Voting out Republicans would represent change.
A yes vote on state questions can represent significant change. Some people wrongly thought Oklahomans wouldn't be able to legalize medical marijuana for many more years to come. Oklahoma is fortunate to have a petitioning process to try to work around Republican state legislators and their prohibitive laws. So, I won't be surprised a state question will be on the ballot to give legal access to abortion, possibly based on body autonomy, in 2024 and it will pass.

Oklahoma Abortion Rights Advocates React To Kansas Vote To Protect Abortions (newson6.com)
 
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I'd love for you to be right. Kansas is not Oklahoma (go look up any federal election map from the last 16 years) and it won't be as simple as Kansas abortion laws where people effectively voted to keep things as they are. Voting out Republicans would represent change.
Unless I'm misreading your comment, Oklahoma hasn't historically been a rock solid given for Republicans as Governor. Henry was a two-termer and he only preceded Fallin which wasn't too far back if you recall. Then before that it was either a switch every election, or solid Democrat. You may hit the bullseye on your thought of a runaway for Stitt, but I just can't believe he'll take it that easily.
 
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Unless I'm misreading your comment, Oklahoma hasn't historically been a rock solid given for Republicans as Governor. Henry was a two-termer and he only preceded Fallin which wasn't too far back if you recall. Then before that it was either a switch every election, or solid Democrat. You may hit the bullseye on your thought of a runaway for Stitt, but I just can't believe he'll take it that easily.
Calling it now and you can bookmark this to rub in my face if I'm wrong. Stitt will win by 10 or more percentage points.
 

Duke Silver

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Unless I'm misreading your comment, Oklahoma hasn't historically been a rock solid given for Republicans as Governor. Henry was a two-termer and he only preceded Fallin which wasn't too far back if you recall. Then before that it was either a switch every election, or solid Democrat. You may hit the bullseye on your thought of a runaway for Stitt, but I just can't believe he'll take it that easily.
Isn't Stitt only the 4th Republican governor?