SCOTUS to overturn Roe v Wade

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RxCowboy

I'm your huckleberry. That's just my game.
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Closer to Stillwater today than I was last year
Our country is in a sad state. Everything is extreme right or left. The middle needs stand up and develop candidates.
That's why I say there are no conservatives left. The two parties have become, "I'm for whatever you're against, and I'm against whatever you're for."

I became a Republican because of Ronald Reagan. Reagan would not recognize this Republican party, or the Democratic party for that matter. If you listen to old Reagan or JFK speeches there are foundational principles, bedrock upon which everything else is built. I simply don't see foundational principles from either party any more.
 

PF5

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No, we trust the citizens of each state to decide for themselves what they want rather than the federal government. Interesting through all of this you’ve been silent on the existing process that allows states to create their own death with dignity laws. Based on your posting record I would have expected to see you leading the charge for a federal law allowing it instead of each state.
me thinks majority of Oklahomans would be pro-choice...
 
Mar 11, 2006
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me thinks majority of Oklahomans would be pro-choice...
I would imagine that like a lot of issues that; 1) the poll results depend of how that question is asked.

National Gallup polls show pro-choice (48%) and pro-life (46%) almost evenly split.
But I assume that if you asked if there should be some restrictions on abortion (ie no abortion past 25 week), then probably 70%+ would agree.
And I assume if you asked if no abortion allowed at all under any circumstance that 70%+ would disagree.

Problem continues that the far-right want to pass some extremely restrictive laws and the far-left wants to pass laws allowing for aborting babies at any time of pregnancy (and with former VA Gov Ralph Northam — including killing babies right after birth).

Like everything extreme views keep from reasonable laws from being passed that best protects the rights of all.
 
May 4, 2011
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I would imagine that like a lot of issues that; 1) the poll results depend of how that question is asked.

National Gallup polls show pro-choice (48%) and pro-life (46%) almost evenly split.
But I assume that if you asked if there should be some restrictions on abortion (ie no abortion past 25 week), then probably 70%+ would agree.
And I assume if you asked if no abortion allowed at all under any circumstance that 70%+ would disagree.

Problem continues that the far-right want to pass some extremely restrictive laws and the far-left wants to pass laws allowing for aborting babies at any time of pregnancy (and with former VA Gov Ralph Northam — including killing babies right after birth).

Like everything extreme views keep from reasonable laws from being passed that best protects the rights of all.
I'd also guess that the extreme stances are often reflections of their opposition to the other extreme rather than truly held beliefs if they thought it through independent of what the other side said. The no abortions ever side seems to see any argument dor some as just an excuse to have open season on elective abortion whereas the other side sees any restrictions as the slippery slope toward no abortions in any scenario. They then become the bogeyman for each other to reinforce their views. Meanwhile, most of us are between those two camps, but get more often don't get the same attention because we aren't as loud as either extreme.
 

CocoCincinnati

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so my point is, why do politicians not feel the need to do what the voters want??
Because we the people are ignorant and apathetic most of the time when it comes to politics and the politicians know this. On this issue though, I think state politicians are at least trying to do what their base wants.
 
May 4, 2011
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With regards to abortion what do the polls say?

https://news.gallup.com/poll/1576/abortion.aspx

Abortion under any circumstance has support of approximately 1/3 of the public.
And consistently about 20% want it illegal in all circumstances. The largest group wants it legal with some restrictions, which is more or less what we have. If Roe really is overturned, we will see it banned in almost all circumstances in some states. I'd also guess we'll see Jewish people successfully sue in some of those places because many Jews, including orthodox, see it as a mandate to get an abortion if there's any significant risk of death to the mother.
 
Mar 11, 2006
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so my point is, why do politicians not feel the need to do what the voters want??
It is a math and survival game for the politicians. They help secure their own re-election by appealing to groups that make the most noise. I think for some issues (abortion is a great example) that they are doing what the loudest portion of the core base want. I am not a fan of either extremes, but they are loud, they march, they protest, they post heavily on social media, and they insure their views are picked up by the press.

If issues are ~50/50 (which many are), probably about 20%-25% of each 50 strongly make their cases for their views. And a good portion of the remaining 50 on each side don't care super-strongly one way or the other. And their vote is not going to be changed by how the politician votes on the subject ---- so sometimes the safest place for the politician to go is to follow the loudest group in their party.
 

Cimarron

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And consistently about 20% want it illegal in all circumstances. The largest group wants it legal with some restrictions, which is more or less what we have. If Roe really is overturned, we will see it banned in almost all circumstances in some states. I'd also guess we'll see Jewish people successfully sue in some of those places because many Jews, including orthodox, see it as a mandate to get an abortion if there's any significant risk of death to the mother.
I'm on the side of legal with restrictions.

I'm also on the side that many of these issues should be at the state level as our constitution intended.

The idea of a large centralized government isn't appealing to me....
 

oks10

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I'm on the side of legal with restrictions.

I'm also on the side that many of these issues should be at the state level as our constitution intended.


The idea of a large centralized government isn't appealing to me....
And herein lies the issue. These two statements contradict each other in many states like Oklahoma...
 

Cimarron

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And herein lies the issue. These two statements contradict each other in many states like Oklahoma...
Why is that any more of an issue than it is with many other laws? There are many laws that aren't the same across state lines and while in one state you may be in lock step with the law and in another you aren't.

Many states have different tax codes, is that also an issue?
 

oks10

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Why is that any more of an issue than it is with many other laws? There are many laws that aren't the same across state lines and while in one state you may be in lock step with the law and in another you aren't.
I'm just saying that for people that are for legal abortion, they know where their state legislatures stand. For many people their state is already ready to fully ban it and is just waiting for that authority to come back to the states. Seems self inflicting to be in favor of giving something you think should be legal back to to the states which you know will make it illegal.
 

Cimarron

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I'm just saying that for people that are for legal abortion, they know where their state legislatures stand. For many people their state is already ready to fully ban it and is just waiting for that authority to come back to the states. Seems self inflicting to be in favor of giving something you think should be legal back to to the states which you know will make it illegal.
I don't base my political position for multiple issues on a single issue?
 

oks10

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I'm just saying that for people that are for legal abortion, they know where their state legislatures stand. For many people their state is already ready to fully ban it and is just waiting for that authority to come back to the states. Seems self inflicting to be in favor of giving something you think should be legal back to to the states which you know will make it illegal.
I don't base my political position for multiple issues on a single issue?
I understand what you're saying. I'm not trying to claim it's right or wrong, I'm just pointing out why some people that are for legal abortion would be against this.

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