SCOTUS to overturn Roe v Wade

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Mar 11, 2006
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We will be in the middle as a nationwide average. I don't think women will need to fear arrest in Maryland. But in Texas, Oklahoma, part of the south, I could see such a law getting passed. I would not call them the extreme or else they would be jeopardizing their position by saying such things. AOC seems extreme in Oklahoma. She isn't in NY.
She may not be extreme for her particular NY district. But she is on the extreme side for NY.
 
May 4, 2011
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Let’s once again be very clear on this. The draft opinion doesn’t ban anything, as part of your comment (and others I’ve red) tries to imply. It’s also very clear this opinion does not put issues like that in the crosshairs. It does nothing more that put the issue on the equivalence of deaths with individual state death with dignity legislation, which by the way is an issue I don’t believe abortion advocates are complaining needs to be a federal issue.
I felt like that was fairly obvious in the context of the conversation and with the "if" part. If the opinion changes, you might be right. If the leaked draft becomes the majority opinion, your interpretation would not be accurate. It probably won't become the majority opinion, but significant change seems likely. We don't know what variety of significant change we're dealing with, but discussing the implications of the Alito draft seems fair game until we do since we do have a Justice who is indicating he'd favor reversing those decisions and leaving them for the states.
 

RxCowboy

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The trimester system set up by RvW is something else I had an issue with. As advances in medical services push the viability time further back, the trimester system set up as Constitutional in nature becomes less defensible.
This is the problem with "viability" in PPP v Casey. Viability is entirely dependent on technology.
 

RxCowboy

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I think so, but Ginsburg was talking about the focus and tack of the decision not being focused on the right of the women (equal protection) rather than the trimester scheme devised being designed to let providers know when it would be legal and not.
I went back and looked at my notes. In addition to Jane Roe, Dr. James Hallford, and John and Mary Doe were also plaintiffs in the suit. Hallford's claim was that it interfered with the physician-patient relationship. SCOTUS denied standing to Hallford and the Does. So, Ginsburg is basically saying that Roe was focused on the physician-patient relationship regardless of whether Hallford had standing in the suit, and that it would have been better decided under the equal protection clause, which would have had nothing to do with the physician-patient relationship; and in fact, nothing to do with medicine at all.

Interesting, in my notes, a lower court also refused standing for the Does, but also found the Texas law unconstitutional, but refused to stop enforcement.
 

StillwaterTownie

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There are things like that with safe drops at fire stations and hospitals in many places. I don't see Republicans fighting to take them away? Sounds pretty much like a straw man that you're trying to throw up.

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But the point of concern is that not every woman with an unwanted newborn may know that, so info about it needs to get out there.
 
Jul 5, 2020
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Ohh Ohh here is a good one.

Woman arrested and charged with sexual assault for poking holes in the condom of her partner in an attempt to get pregnant.

Would the man be able to get a court ordered abortion performed on her if she became pregnant ? Many seem ok with supporting a legal abortion in the case of rape. Is there a legitimate point that can be argued that a woman who performed sexual assault in the process of becoming pregnant can be forced into an abortion against her will as the child is a product of rape?

Is it possible maybe even ironic...some of us.... would support a woman being forced into an unwanted abortion by law if she raped the guy to get pregnant..

but will not support the idea of a woman having the ability to make that same choice on her own

We trust the court decision more than we trust our women's decisions.
No, we trust the citizens of each state to decide for themselves what they want rather than the federal government. Interesting through all of this you’ve been silent on the existing process that allows states to create their own death with dignity laws. Based on your posting record I would have expected to see you leading the charge for a federal law allowing it instead of each state.
 

Jostate

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Jun 24, 2005
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I'm pro choice, but I think the pro choice crowd needs to find a better rallying cry than "My body my choice!!!". It sounds egocentric and like a spoiled child who demands to get his way.

I honestly don't know the alternative because I know everything has to be boiled down to 3 or 4 words or rhyme with "Hey hey, ho ho" for some reason, but I don't think they are winning many over by sounding like they plan on getting knocked up again and want an easy out.
 

steross

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No, we trust the citizens of each state to decide for themselves what they want rather than the federal government.
I'm not sure who you were talking about when you said "we" but that is not where the Republican leadership is heading. I've said it over and over, anyone that thinks the Republican party is the party of small federal government is blind to reality. They simply use that wording to get their way.

“If the leaked opinion became the final opinion, legislative bodies — not only at the state level but at the federal level — certainly could legislate in that area,” Mr. McConnell said when asked if a national abortion ban was “worthy of debate.”

Senator Lindsey Graham, Republican of South Carolina, said on “Fox News Sunday” that he would push a bill to outlaw abortion nationwide after 20 weeks of pregnancy.

https://www.nytimes.com/2022/05/08/...te=1&user_id=b7d23fc16ade4050a2b1cd2d3db383ec
 

CocoCincinnati

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Louisiana already considering a bill in the legislature that criminalizes IUDs and authorizes prosecution of the woman that uses it.
This would be the very definition of stupid. I have looked for more info but every single article I found said the Louisiana law COULD make them illegal. Either it will or it won't. Anyway to confirm?
 

CocoCincinnati

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I'm pro choice, but I think the pro choice crowd needs to find a better rallying cry than "My body my choice!!!". It sounds egocentric and like a spoiled child who demands to get his way.

I honestly don't know the alternative because I know everything has to be boiled down to 3 or 4 words or rhyme with "Hey hey, ho ho" for some reason, but I don't think they are winning many over by sounding like they plan on getting knocked up again and want an easy out.
It used to be "legal, safe and rare" but you never hear that anymore.
 

CowboyJD

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Dec 10, 2004
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This would be the very definition of stupid. I have looked for more info but every single article I found said the Louisiana law COULD make them illegal. Either it will or it won't. Anyway to confirm?
The way that the statues already define "abortion" in Louisiana law will make them illegal because they are a device that keeps the life (as defined by their law as at conception if the law passes) from implanting in the uterus. That's my opinion reading the totality of the statutes.

The only way to confirm that interpretation will be when a prosecutor prosecutes someone for an IUD and the courts interpret it as a matter of law.
 
Jul 10, 2009
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I'm pro choice, but I think the pro choice crowd needs to find a better rallying cry than "My body my choice!!!". It sounds egocentric and like a spoiled child who demands to get his way.

I honestly don't know the alternative because I know everything has to be boiled down to 3 or 4 words or rhyme with "Hey hey, ho ho" for some reason, but I don't think they are winning many over by sounding like they plan on getting knocked up again and want an easy out.
Where were these "My body, my choice" protestors when they were trying to make vaccines mandatory?
 

TheMonkey

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The way that the statues already define "abortion" in Louisiana law will make them illegal because they are a device that keeps the life (as defined by their law as at conception if the law passes) from implanting in the uterus. That's my opinion reading the totality of the statutes.

The only way to confirm that interpretation will be when a prosecutor prosecutes someone for an IUD and the courts interpret it as a matter of law.
My daughter told me about this and I asked her if she had anything more than Tweets with no sources. She couldn’t find any sources, so I assumed it was hyperbole.

Now I have to tell her she was right. Thanks a lot.
 

OSUCowboy787

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In reality the overturn of Roe v Wade has nothing at all to do with abortion but instead the fact that the Supreme court is saying it shouldn't be the ones legislating. It is pushing these decisions to the states and or congress if they would actually do their jobs then this whole point would be moot. Whether you like the decision or not I have to applaud the court for beginning a stance that the courts do not make laws, they just interpret them as produced and signed by congress or state governments etc.
 

CowboyJD

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Where were these "My body, my choice" protestors when they were trying to make vaccines mandatory?
Where are the "My body, my choice" protesters that did protest when they were trying to make vaccines mandatory now that we're talking about abortion.