Knight Commission Recommends FBS Split From NCAA

[OstatePokes]

All I can say is it is about time. Obviously, this is just a recommendation, but I would favor this move.

The recommendation is to split the football bowl subdivision away from the NCAA.

https://www.espn.com/college-football/story/_/id/30444422/knight-commission-endorses-fbs-split-ncaa

 

[RxCowboy]

The problem is all other sports. It won't work.

 

[osupsycho]

The problem is all other sports. It won't work.

There suggestion is for just the sport of football to break away. All the other sports at all the schools would remain under NCAA. With that I can see this actually happening. I mean the NCAA gets to keep their March Madness cash cow and dump off their headache of Power 5 football where they don't get the money anyway. If this is done right it could be game changing, if they setup actual divisions.

 

[osupsycho]

Here is one example that I have seen of that taking 72 teams:

SEC

SEC East: Clemson, Georgia, Florida, Kentucky, South Carolina, Tennessee

SEC West: Alabama, Auburn, Florida State, LSU, Mississippi State, Ole Miss


Big 12
Big 12 North: Kansas, Kansas State, Missouri, Nebraska, Oklahoma, Oklahoma State

Big 12 South: Arkansas, Baylor, Colorado, Texas, Texas A&M, Texas Tech


Big Ten
Big Ten East: Illinois, Indiana, Michigan, Michigan State, Ohio State, Purdue

Big 10 West: Iowa, Iowa State, Minnesota, Notre Dame, Penn State, Wisconsin


ACC
ACC North: Duke, Louisville, North Carolina, Virginia, Virginia Tech, N.C. State

ACC South: Central Florida (UCF), Georgia Tech, Miami (FL), South Florida (USF), Vanderbilt, Wake Forest


Pac-12
Pac-12 North: Boise State, California, Oregon, Oregon State, Washington, Washington State

Pac-12 South: Arizona, Arizona State, Stanford, UCLA, USC, Utah


Big East
Big East North: Army, Boston College, Navy, Rutgers, Syracuse, Temple

Big East South: Appalachian State, East Carolina, Maryland, Marshall, Pittsburgh, West Virginia

 

[OkstateKerr]

Here is one example that I have seen of that taking 72 teams:

SEC

SEC East: Clemson, Georgia, Florida, Kentucky, South Carolina, Tennessee

SEC West: Alabama, Auburn, Florida State, LSU, Mississippi State, Ole Miss


Big 12
Big 12 North: Kansas, Kansas State, Missouri, Nebraska, Oklahoma, Oklahoma State

Big 12 South: Arkansas, Baylor, Colorado, Texas, Texas A&M, Texas Tech


Big Ten
Big Ten East: Illinois, Indiana, Michigan, Michigan State, Ohio State, Purdue

Big 10 West: Iowa, Iowa State, Minnesota, Notre Dame, Penn State, Wisconsin


ACC
ACC North: Duke, Louisville, North Carolina, Virginia, Virginia Tech, N.C. State

ACC South: Central Florida (UCF), Georgia Tech, Miami (FL), South Florida (USF), Vanderbilt, Wake Forest


Pac-12
Pac-12 North: Boise State, California, Oregon, Oregon State, Washington, Washington State

Pac-12 South: Arizona, Arizona State, Stanford, UCLA, USC, Utah


Big East
Big East North: Army, Boston College, Navy, Rutgers, Syracuse, Temple

Big East South: Appalachian State, East Carolina, Maryland, Marshall, Pittsburgh, West Virginia

I would cut the entire Big East out and just have 60 teams. Not a single good football team outside of West Virginia. Probably cut a team from one of the other leagues to shoe horn it in.

 

[RxCowboy]

There suggestion is for just the sport of football to break away. All the other sports at all the schools would remain under NCAA. With that I can see this actually happening. I mean the NCAA gets to keep their March Madness cash cow and dump off their headache of Power 5 football where they don't get the money anyway. If this is done right it could be game changing, if they setup actual divisions.

From the NCAA bylaws:
3.1.2.2 Combining Entire Athletics Programs. The institutions shall combine their entire athletics programs, and the consortium shall not be formed on a sport-by-sport basis. (Revised: 7/30/10)

You can't break one sport away from the NCAA and keep other sports as members. You would have to break away from the NCAA entirely, all sports. It ain't gonna happen.

 

[osupsycho]

From the NCAA bylaws:
3.1.2.2 Combining Entire Athletics Programs. The institutions shall combine their entire athletics programs, and the consortium shall not be formed on a sport-by-sport basis. (Revised: 7/30/10)

You can't break one sport away from the NCAA and keep other sports as members. You would have to break away from the NCAA entirely, all sports. It ain't gonna happen.

You act like they can't change their own rules? Heck even in that it shows they revised it in 2010. If the NCAA decides to do this they certainly can.

This is the key part of the story:
"The commission's proposal to separate FBS football from the NCAA would leave those big-time football programs in charge of creating a new entity that would develop and enforce rules, determine eligibility requirements, set health and safety standards, and organize a national championship.

The NCAA currently provides all those services for college football except for organizing a championship. The NCAA organizes championships for most sports, but college football's postseason -- and the significant money that it generates -- is controlled by a separate entity called the College Football Playoff."

In other words the NCAA currently does all the dirty work for FBS football, but does not get the financial benefits as those go to the College Football Playoff. Thus this makes perfect sense for the NCAA to do as it solves that issue for them while at the same time mostly fixing the amateur athlete debate for them (basketball will still be somewhat of an issue but not as bad as football).

 

[osupsycho]

I would cut the entire Big East out and just have 60 teams. Not a single good football team outside of West Virginia. Probably cut a team from one of the other leagues to shoe horn it in.

I can see both sides. They may have to take some of those teams to get the approvals they would need. Plus 6 divisions make more sense when planning a playoff from them. But yeah that is a lot of questionable teams to bring in.

 

[RxCowboy]

You act like they can't change their own rules? Heck even in that it shows they revised it in 2010. If the NCAA decides to do this they certainly can.

This is the key part of the story:
"The commission's proposal to separate FBS football from the NCAA would leave those big-time football programs in charge of creating a new entity that would develop and enforce rules, determine eligibility requirements, set health and safety standards, and organize a national championship.

The NCAA currently provides all those services for college football except for organizing a championship. The NCAA organizes championships for most sports, but college football's postseason -- and the significant money that it generates -- is controlled by a separate entity called the College Football Playoff."

In other words the NCAA currently does all the dirty work for FBS football, but does not get the financial benefits as those go to the College Football Playoff. Thus this makes perfect sense for the NCAA to do as it solves that issue for them while at the same time mostly fixing the amateur athlete debate for them (basketball will still be somewhat of an issue but not as bad as football).

You need to read the article again. To wit:

The Knight Commission, a reform-minded independent group of university presidents, former athletic directors and others, spent the past year studying the current state of college sports before making its recommendation.​

​

It isn't the NCAA that wants to do this. Why should the NCAA change their bylaws and give up control?

 

[OSUinTX]

I would cut the entire Big East out and just have 60 teams. Not a single good football team outside of West Virginia. Probably cut a team from one of the other leagues to shoe horn it in.

Vanderbilt. Bad program, perennial loser, can easily be swapped.

A couple other teams in the Big East would be deserving such as Pittsburg.

A huge problem with this scenario is that it essentially cuts out the Mountain Time Zone and despite there being few schools there that would be worthy, there would be a ruckus.

And the geography of the B12 makes no sense.

 

[OSUinTX]

You need to read the article again. To wit:

The Knight Commission, a reform-minded independent group of university presidents, former athletic directors and others, spent the past year studying the current state of college sports before making its recommendation.​

​

It isn't the NCAA that wants to do this. Why should the NCAA change their bylaws and give up control?

Correct me if I am wrong, but is not the NCAA even in existence at the discretion of the individual schools? If all the school presidents voted to bolt, what could the NCAA do to stop them?

 

[osupsycho]

You need to read the article again. To wit:

The Knight Commission, a reform-minded independent group of university presidents, former athletic directors and others, spent the past year studying the current state of college sports before making its recommendation.​

​

It isn't the NCAA that wants to do this. Why should the NCAA change their bylaws and give up control?

Read the rest of my post, I laid out why it makes sense for the NCAA to do this. Short version... they currently have all the headaches but none of the reward for FBS football. This would allow them to solve that while also allowing them to maintain their coveted allusion that they represent amateur student athletes.

 

[RxCowboy]

Correct me if I am wrong, but is not the NCAA even in existence at the discretion of the individual schools? If all the school presidents voted to bolt, what could the NCAA do to stop them?

Yes, but we're not talking about all the school presidents bolting, are we.

Read the rest of my post, I laid out why it makes sense for the NCAA to do this. Short version... they currently have all the headaches but none of the reward for FBS football. This would allow them to solve that while also allowing them to maintain their coveted allusion that they represent amateur student athletes.

You really see the NCAA ceding that much power? Because I don't.

 

[osupsycho]

Yes, but we're not talking about all the school presidents bolting, are we.

You really see the NCAA ceding that much power? Because I don't.

But that is the thing, the NCAA does not really have any power over FBS football now so they are not ceding much. They lost control of it back when they lost the TV rights to the schools themselves. The NCAA will still have power over those schools as well since they will control all of their other sports.

 

[OSUinTX]

Yes, but we're not talking about all the school presidents bolting, are we.

You really see the NCAA ceding that much power? Because I don't.

"All" was a generalized collective term. If those that want to leave, do so, what could the NCAA do about it? If a small number leave, meh. Good luck on your own. But if you start getting into the dozens and those dozens include big-name schools, then I would think the movement snowballs.

This has the potential to be even bigger than the old OU and Georgia fight against the NCAA as the fledgling CFA so they could negotiate their own TV contracts. NCAA had their proverbial hats handed to them. An interesting bit from that trial was the NCAA claimed that it was a voluntary organization and if the plaintiffs or other schools did not wish to abide by the NCAA rules, they were free to terminate their membership. IMO, for this to work, it would have to be a concerted effort in an all-at-once movement, not a handful here, a handful there.

 

[OstatePokes]

I agree with @osupsycho, and to add to those points, it has often been mentioned by those that would know that the NCAA wouldn’t want to lose men’s basketball. So they might be willing to let football break off if they got to keep basketball and March Madness.

 

[RxCowboy]

"All" was a generalized collective term. If those that want to leave, do so, what could the NCAA do about it? If a small number leave, meh. Good luck on your own. But if you start getting into the dozens and those dozens include big-name schools, then I would think the movement snowballs.

This has the potential to be even bigger than the old OU and Georgia fight against the NCAA as the fledgling CFA so they could negotiate their own TV contracts. NCAA had their proverbial hats handed to them. An interesting bit from that trial was the NCAA claimed that it was a voluntary organization and if the plaintiffs or other schools did not wish to abide by the NCAA rules, they were free to terminate their membership. IMO, for this to work, it would have to be a concerted effort in an all-at-once movement, not a handful here, a handful there.

They are indeed free to terminate their memberships, but there's a reason why no one has done so, because it would include all other sports. Power 5 works great for football, not so much for anything else.

 

[wrenhal]

There suggestion is for just the sport of football to break away. All the other sports at all the schools would remain under NCAA. With that I can see this actually happening. I mean the NCAA gets to keep their March Madness cash cow and dump off their headache of Power 5 football where they don't get the money anyway. If this is done right it could be game changing, if they setup actual divisions.

From the NCAA bylaws:
3.1.2.2 Combining Entire Athletics Programs. The institutions shall combine their entire athletics programs, and the consortium shall not be formed on a sport-by-sport basis. (Revised: 7/30/10)

You can't break one sport away from the NCAA and keep other sports as members. You would have to break away from the NCAA entirely, all sports. It ain't gonna happen.

When was the last time the NCAA had anything to do with football (championships, etc...) Other than making and policing rules on an uneven basis.

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[wrenhal]

I would cut the entire Big East out and just have 60 teams. Not a single good football team outside of West Virginia. Probably cut a team from one of the other leagues to shoe horn it in.

I can see both sides. They may have to take some of those teams to get the approvals they would need. Plus 6 divisions make more sense when planning a playoff from them. But yeah that is a lot of questionable teams to bring in.

Plus you need doormats to play against.

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[MustangPokeFan]

The ACC and the Big East both look weak in that chart compared with the other conferences!