Kasey Dunn

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Birry

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I can't remember what year, maybe 2005, Arky State and FIU played 3OT that end 3-0. Can't remember who won that pillowfight. But if you hold the other team to zero they can't win and you only need to score once to win.

OTOH, in 2011 we lost a shoot out in Ames because our defense couldn't stop a junior high team. We lost to a mediocre Iowa State with the best offense we have had since 1988. It cost us a chance at a national championship. And, oh, btw, in 1988 if we had a defense even in the top 50 we would have gone undefeated.

But I know I am not going to change your mind or end the sophistry. Whine on McDuff!

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On the flip side, we had a chance to play for the NC in 2011......so it seems nonsensical to use that season as your supporting evidence for why that style of play doesn't work or should be avoided. We haven't been remotely close in any other recent season. Yet we went away from that style. Why? Please provide evidence that our new style of play is better.
 

TheMonkey

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For the sake of all that is holy… can we please move on?

Dunn called a gem last week. Let’s hope he does it against Baylor Saturday. We’re ratcheting up the competition.
 

Cimarron

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OTOH, in 2011 we lost a shoot out in Ames because our defense couldn't stop a junior high team. We lost to a mediocre Iowa State with the best offense we have had since 1988. It cost us a chance at a national championship. And, oh, btw, in 1988 if we had a defense even in the top 50 we would have gone undefeated.
A shoot out? It was 24-24 at the end of regulation. It was the fewest points the OSU offense scored during regulation that season.

It was actually one of our better defensive efforts of the season, ISU scored 24 points in regulation. Our fourth best outing that season.

Texas Tech 6 points
Oklahoma 10 points
Arizona 14 points
Iowa State 24 points
Missouri 24 points
Baylor 24 points
Texas 26 points
Kansas 28 points
Tulsa 33 points
Texas A&M 33 points
Louisiana 34 points
Stanford 38 points
Kansas State 45 points
 

andylicious

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Did anyone read the article in the TW this morning where Gundy talks about the decision a few years ago to take four scholarships away from the offense each year and dedicate them to the defensive side of the ball? He also talked about ball control and limiting the number of offensive snaps the opposing team gets in a game Explains a lot of why we are playing the ay we have the last couple of years. I can get on board with this strategy as long as we continue to consistently win

My biggest concern with this present day strategy is special teams. They are even more critical in a short games. Missed FGs and extra points are back breakers in a low scoring game. Your punt team has to win the field position battle and heaven forbid if you give up a kick off return like Saturday.

I just thought these were interesting topics that the article brought up.


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Defense can win games, but you still have to score and sometimes the best defense is an overwhelming offense. Your points on the kicking game are dead spot on, if Bailey is kicking that field goal at Iowa State we win.

I was glad to see Saturday's game it did give a look into more aggressive offense. They need to keep dropping the hammer.
 
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Defense can win games, but you still have to score and sometimes the best defense is an overwhelming offense. Your points on the kicking game are dead spot on, if Bailey is kicking that field goal at Iowa State we win.

I was glad to see Saturday's game it did give a look into more aggressive offense. They need to keep dropping the hammer.
I will never be convinced that that FG was anything other than good.

Also, Dez caught it.
 

RxCowboy

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OTOH, in 2011 we lost a shoot out in Ames because our defense couldn't stop a junior high team. We lost to a mediocre Iowa State with the best offense we have had since 1988. It cost us a chance at a national championship. And, oh, btw, in 1988 if we had a defense even in the top 50 we would have gone undefeated.
A shoot out? It was 24-24 at the end of regulation. It was the fewest points the OSU offense scored during regulation that season.

It was actually one of our better defensive efforts of the season, ISU scored 24 points in regulation. Our fourth best outing that season.

Texas Tech 6 points
Oklahoma 10 points
Arizona 14 points
Iowa State 24 points
Missouri 24 points
Baylor 24 points
Texas 26 points
Kansas 28 points
Tulsa 33 points
Texas A&M 33 points
Louisiana 34 points
Stanford 38 points
Kansas State 45 points
One of our better defensive efforts... lol! So good that we won, right?

Man, that was a brilliant piece of sophistry.



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RxCowboy

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Did anyone read the article in the TW this morning where Gundy talks about the decision a few years ago to take four scholarships away from the offense each year and dedicate them to the defensive side of the ball? He also talked about ball control and limiting the number of offensive snaps the opposing team gets in a game Explains a lot of why we are playing the ay we have the last couple of years. I can get on board with this strategy as long as we continue to consistently win

My biggest concern with this present day strategy is special teams. They are even more critical in a short games. Missed FGs and extra points are back breakers in a low scoring game. Your punt team has to win the field position battle and heaven forbid if you give up a kick off return like Saturday.

I just thought these were interesting topics that the article brought up.


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Defense can win games, but you still have to score and sometimes the best defense is an overwhelming offense. Your points on the kicking game are dead spot on, if Bailey is kicking that field goal at Iowa State we win.

I was glad to see Saturday's game it did give a look into more aggressive offense. They need to keep dropping the hammer.
That's a tautology. It would be just as accurate to say offense can win games but sometimes you need defense to keep the other team from scoring.

Under Gundy, we've lost shoot outs, we have yet to lose a game where we hold the opponent to 20 or less.

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Cimarron

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One of our better defensive efforts... lol! So good that we won, right?

Man, that was a brilliant piece of sophistry.



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The score says it was one of our better defensive efforts OSU had that year, during regulation. It was the offense that under performed, given their typical game that year, in regards to scoring.

How is this deceiving?

Texas Tech 6 points
Oklahoma 10 points
Arizona 14 points
Iowa State 24 points
Missouri 24 points
Baylor 24 points


Texas 26 points
Kansas 28 points
Tulsa 33 points
Texas A&M 33 points
Louisiana 34 points
Stanford 38 points
Kansas State 45 points

If this game was a shoot out, is the average game a shoot out? In 2012, the average score per team was 29.5 points.
 

RxCowboy

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The score says it was one of our better defensive efforts OSU had that year, during regulation. It was the offense that under performed, given their typical game that year, in regards to scoring.

How is this deceiving?

Texas Tech 6 points
Oklahoma 10 points
Arizona 14 points
Iowa State 24 points
Missouri 24 points
Baylor 24 points


Texas 26 points
Kansas 28 points
Tulsa 33 points
Texas A&M 33 points
Louisiana 34 points
Stanford 38 points
Kansas State 45 points

If this game was a shoot out, is the average game a shoot out? In 2012, the average score per team was 29.5 points.
In 2011 Iowa State was averaging 22.7 ppg. We gave up 37. Even if you only count the scores at the end of regulation, we still gave up more than their average. But you have to count the total score because that is what puts a mark in the L column.
They were passing for 212 ypg. We gave up 376.
They were rushing for 174 ypg. We gave up 192.
568 yards total offense, their average was 386.5.
They picked up 33 first downs, their average was 21.
TOP 35:13 to our 24:47.

All this to the #90 offense in the land. They played keep away from us and we couldn't stop them. There is no freaking way on earth you can call that defensive performance "good".

Think about what you're defending... you're defending a loss. You're pissing and moaning about wins. What the freak are your priorities?
 
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In 2011 Iowa State was averaging 22.7 ppg. We gave up 37. Even if you only count the scores at the end of regulation, we still gave up more than their average. But you have to count the total score because that is what puts a mark in the L column.
They were passing for 212 ypg. We gave up 376.
They were rushing for 174 ypg. We gave up 192.
568 yards total offense, their average was 386.5.
They picked up 33 first downs, their average was 21.
TOP 35:13 to our 24:47.

All this to the #90 offense in the land. They played keep away from us and we couldn't stop them. There is no freaking way on earth you can call that defensive performance "good".

Think about what you're defending... you're defending a loss. You're pissing and moaning about wins. What the freak are your priorities?
I actually think there is some truth to both sides of this argument and the numbers don't tell the whole story. With that offense in 2011, if we held any team to 24 points in regulation, it usually meant we had won by at least 2 touchdowns. So I think it's fair to say the defense did well enough to win under normal circumstances. And if I remember that game, we jumped out to a pretty comfortable lead and then just kind of started coasting on offense. Then they started to make a few plays and got momentum, and you know how momentum goes, once you lose it, it's pretty hard to get it back. We let them hang around until late in the game, and let the crowd get into it and it cost us a natty. Then add in a missed field goal that he makes 9 out of 10 times and you can say special teams cost us the game. I tend to lean more towards agreeing with Cim on this one, yikes!
 

OSUMIKE17

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I actually think there is some truth to both sides of this argument and the numbers don't tell the whole story. With that offense in 2011, if we held any team to 24 points in regulation, it usually meant we had won by at least 2 touchdowns. So I think it's fair to say the defense did well enough to win under normal circumstances. And if I remember that game, we jumped out to a pretty comfortable lead and then just kind of started coasting on offense. Then they started to make a few plays and got momentum, and you know how momentum goes, once you lose it, it's pretty hard to get it back. We let them hang around until late in the game, and let the crowd get into it and it cost us a natty. Then add in a missed field goal that he makes 9 out of 10 times and you can say special teams cost us the game. I tend to lean more towards agreeing with Cim on this one, yikes!
Five turnovers (three INTs and two fumbles) are what cost us against ISU that year.

And in that regard, those hurt us both offensively and defensively.
 
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Not to mention the lowest Squinky ever sunk with the Budke/Serna tragedy the day before. It was also a short week and the plane returning from Lubbock the previous Saturday was delayed many hours. The Fates just don't favor OSU very often. That entire week was a mess.
 

Cimarron

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In 2011 Iowa State was averaging 22.7 ppg. We gave up 37. Even if you only count the scores at the end of regulation, we still gave up more than their average. But you have to count the total score because that is what puts a mark in the L column.
They were passing for 212 ypg. We gave up 376.
They were rushing for 174 ypg. We gave up 192.
568 yards total offense, their average was 386.5.
They picked up 33 first downs, their average was 21.
TOP 35:13 to our 24:47.

All this to the #90 offense in the land. They played keep away from us and we couldn't stop them. There is no freaking way on earth you can call that defensive performance "good".

Think about what you're defending... you're defending a loss. You're pissing and moaning about wins. What the freak are your priorities?
ISU that season averaged 20.1 points per game during regulation (i.e. that does not include overtime which skews the points scored). The game against OSU ISU scored 24 points during regulation.

I never said it was "good", I said it was one of our better defensive performances during regulation that season.

But, I'm out!
 

jobob85

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ISU that season averaged 20.1 points per game during regulation (i.e. that does not include overtime which skews the points scored). The game against OSU ISU scored 24 points during regulation.

I never said it was "good", I said it was one of our better defensive performances during regulation that season.

But, I'm out!
So, if @RxCowboy responds to your post, does he get the last word?
 

CocoCincinnati

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I could actually care less how we win games, offense/defense, it's all good to me. My only addendum is that we, OSU, tend to get better coverage when we are winning with O. Leading the country in 3rd down stops is not interesting to people...leading the country in 30+ yard pass plays is interesting and some of those might make top 10 plays on ESPN. And that's good for recruiting.
 
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I can't remember what year, maybe 2005, Arky State and FIU played 3OT that end 3-0. Can't remember who won that pillowfight. But if you hold the other team to zero they can't win and you only need to score once to win.

OTOH, in 2011 we lost a shoot out in Ames because our defense couldn't stop a junior high team. We lost to a mediocre Iowa State with the best offense we have had since 1988. It cost us a chance at a national championship. And, oh, btw, in 1988 if we had a defense even in the top 50 we would have gone undefeated.

But I know I am not going to change your mind or end the sophistry. Whine on McDuff!

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Main contributor was the fumble by Joseph Randle.

A good FG that was ruled no good was a contributor too.

ISU good LB plays also one of the main reasons.

Combination of thing on that one surreal evening.
 

RxCowboy

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Main contributor was the fumble by Joseph Randle.

A good FG that was ruled no good was a contributor too.

ISU good LB plays also one of the main reasons.

Combination of thing on that one surreal evening.
Typical OSU fan, we make a bad offense look good and it's somehow all the offense's fault we lost. OSU fans somehow can only consider one side of the ball. We were 107th in total defense in 2011. If we had been even in the top 75 we would have been in the BCS championship game. Our defense sucked. We couldn't stop a junior high team, and especially true that night. Not being able to keep the #60 offense in the nation from scoring is shameful.