Game of football will never be the same..

  • You are viewing Orangepower as a Guest. To start new threads, reply to posts, or participate in polls or contests - you must register. Registration is free and easy. Click Here to register.

CowboyHoopsPride

Territorial Marshal
Feb 18, 2009
6,380
3,054
1,743
#41
At the end of the day, this will all still boil down to the 9-0 USSC decision (because that happens so often:whistle:) and their opinions. They all but said you cannot limit student athletes from monetizing their name, image and likeness and if it's used in any way they are owed compensation. They went further to make sure the NCAA understood they were not to be tested with things like "limitations" to what students could make financially. I don't think you'll see anything that caps, reductions, limits, etc from the NCAA, the member institutions, or state legislatures. Why would the state of Oklahoma for example try to manage what students at OSU, ou or Tulsa do and potentially negatively impact a recruit's decision over say what the state of Texas might do?

The NCAA could have done things up proactively but they didn't do anything and now Pandora's box is open.

I maintain that no one forces you to play sports at any level. It's a decision you know all the details to going in and you have free will to decide if you want to be a part of it. The "we're making everyone money and not getting anything" is a copout answer. Don't play then. Or understand the real value of your free ride through college for 5 years and recognize that is absolutely and unequivocally compensation. Especially when you get into a school you otherwise had no chance of attending unless you could trade your athletic services. But that ship as sailed.
 

CowboyHoopsPride

Territorial Marshal
Feb 18, 2009
6,380
3,054
1,743
#42
I wonder if or when Title IX is going to throw a wrench in things?
I don't think it will throw a wrench into it, I think it will be the backbone to make the situation worse. When guys like Barry Switzer say they're going to set up funds to pay football, basketball and softball, then does the women's soccer team sue him? I'd bet dollars to donuts you're going to see that happen. Then you'll have lawsuits over why an o lineman at Texas gets $40-50K a year and the back up setter for the volleyball team get's a dry ham and cheese sandwich. There is no doubt this will happen.
 
Jun 16, 2008
725
102
1,593
Maryland
#43
I wonder if or when Title IX is going to throw a wrench in things?
I don't see how it could but maybe I'm missing something.

Isn't Title 9 all about gender based discrimination? You wondering if women will sue because they can't get access to the same athletic dollars (i.e., NIL money)? That's all separate from the school so how do they file complaint with the school over it unless the school is doing something to unequally support athletes getting NIL deals?
 
Feb 15, 2017
1,797
771
743
67
Texas
#44
I don't think it will throw a wrench into it, I think it will be the backbone to make the situation worse. When guys like Barry Switzer say they're going to set up funds to pay football, basketball and softball, then does the women's soccer team sue him? I'd bet dollars to donuts you're going to see that happen. Then you'll have lawsuits over why an o lineman at Texas gets $40-50K a year and the back up setter for the volleyball team get's a dry ham and cheese sandwich. There is no doubt this will happen.
disagree.

Under the new rules (lack of rules) the schools can't be held accountable for what Boosters do.
If Boosters want to only pay players with red hair, that's ok . .. same as if they want to pay by gender.
 
Sep 12, 2013
1,681
932
743
Broken Arrow, OK
#45
And that’s where it gets tricky. In order for there to be a cap negotiated through collective bargaining there has to be an organization (with structure and experienced leadership) of the players. Call it a union or whatever you want but members, leadership and attorneys will be involved. They will negotiate for benefits, “working conditions”, pay, share of playoff money and bowl money, # of regular season games, # of scholarships, recruiting and signing rules, (signing bonuses), transfer rules and everything else NFL Players Association negotiates. We will see “work stoppages” at some point. And there also has to be organization on the schools side. We can’t have different rules by state or conference. This pushes us to whatever CFB is going to look like ahead of 2033-35. Is it 32 schools or 64 or 80. Then the remaining schools have to get their ish together and organize to protect what they are left with.

I think this is going to get very complex, quickly.
You have just described an NFL developmental league.
 

kaboy42

Territorial Marshal
May 2, 2007
8,571
7,992
1,743
#46
You have just described an NFL developmental league.
And I loveloveLOVE my university, but if and when it gets to this point (and boy are we getting close), I'm "out".

That'll be the proverbial straw that broke the camel's back. :mad:
 
Nov 27, 2007
3,102
1,450
1,743
36
Tulsa
#48
disagree.

Under the new rules (lack of rules) the schools can't be held accountable for what Boosters do.
If Boosters want to only pay players with red hair, that's ok . .. same as if they want to pay by gender.
Were not talking about NCAA rules, we’re talking about laws and potential law suits, future interpretations as it pertains to discrimination and equal rights. Remember, we’re here because of the legal system, not the NCAA. Universities and boosters are exploiting loopholes to circumvent the law and its intended purpose.
All it takes is one judge to set precedent that these co-ops are not permissible or allowed to be operated unregulated and with disregard to laws and government protections.
 

CowboyHoopsPride

Territorial Marshal
Feb 18, 2009
6,380
3,054
1,743
#49
disagree.

Under the new rules (lack of rules) the schools can't be held accountable for what Boosters do.
If Boosters want to only pay players with red hair, that's ok . .. same as if they want to pay by gender.
It’s ok right now because everyone just threw their hands up and said F**k it. Only a matter of time Until someone gets upset enough and makes it an issue. Like I said - I’ll bet a pizza to anyone that you will see a lawsuit brought against people choosing to only pay certain athletes in the next 5 years max.
 

PistolPete'sMustache

Territorial Marshal
A/V Subscriber
Aug 3, 2010
5,077
4,593
1,743
Tulsa, OK
#54
So go back to the way it was? That's not very insightful. We're not going back. And he actually thinks NIL isn't valuable for a high schooler? You don't think Cade Cunningham had any value in high school or until a year in college? If someone is willing to pay it, there is value there. Transfers are going to continue. The changes that will happen are probably a smaller window of time and changes to how scholarships are counted, the way Gundy has been complaining about for a few years. I hate it because my program isn't the blueblood that will win this arms race, but there is just no legal or really rational basis to prevent anyone from making money off their own name, image, and likeness in whatever amount someone is willing to pay.
 

gundysburner

Territorial Marshal
Jul 25, 2018
5,515
1,373
243
51
Boulder, CO
#55
https://www.espn.com/college-sports...hington-pursuit-help-nil-policies-source-says

The goal is to discuss a few of the issues facing college athletics with influential senators," Kliavkoff said. "I think it's more likely that we eventually get federal legislation on name, image and likeness, but we're also interested in discussing all of the harm that will come to student-athletes if they are deemed to be employees."

So go back to the way it was? That's not very insightful. We're not going back. And he actually thinks NIL isn't valuable for a high schooler? You don't think Cade Cunningham had any value in high school or until a year in college? If someone is willing to pay it, there is value there. Transfers are going to continue. The changes that will happen are probably a smaller window of time and changes to how scholarships are counted, the way Gundy has been complaining about for a few years. I hate it because my program isn't the blueblood that will win this arms race, but there is just no legal or really rational basis to prevent anyone from making money off their own name, image, and likeness in whatever amount someone is willing to pay.
Heard Gottlieb on this rant Tuesday. I agree with your sentiment in general, but I think he was trying to push back a little and point out the platform that the university brand also gives to an athlete, which is completely ignored by some people when it comes to this discussion.

Throughout the last couple of years, he's been one of the only voices I've heard pointing out the actual value and cost of the education, housing, and meals that scholarship athletes receive. That point has been largely left out of the discussion most of the time.
 

Jostate

Identifies as a Cowboys fan
A/V Subscriber
Jun 24, 2005
22,953
15,492
1,743
#56
Throughout the last couple of years, he's been one of the only voices I've heard pointing out the actual value and cost of the education, housing, and meals that scholarship athletes receive. That point has been largely left out of the discussion most of the time.
That's been my problem with this whole debate. Anyone who thinks a full scholarship player isn't getting paid is welcome to take care of my son's educational costs. We're about to ship him off soon.
 

gundysburner

Territorial Marshal
Jul 25, 2018
5,515
1,373
243
51
Boulder, CO
#57
That's been my problem with this whole debate. Anyone who thinks a full scholarship player isn't getting paid is welcome to take care of my son's educational costs. We're about to ship him off soon.
There's rarely a mention of all the kids on scholarship who don't bring in a dime of revenue. I've been for players getting some compensation, but the discussion has been largely focused on how wrongfully treated the stars have been.
 

OrangeFan69

LA Face with an Okla. booty.
A/V Subscriber
Apr 24, 2010
8,333
7,873
1,743
44
Los Angeles 90046
instagram.com
#58
That's been my problem with this whole debate. Anyone who thinks a full scholarship player isn't getting paid is welcome to take care of my son's educational costs. We're about to ship him off soon.
I agree a full scholarship is beneficial, but also comes at a significant price ( of potential physical harm and a significant time sacrifice) and typically most football scholarship athletes Are not able to pursue the entire variety of academic options.

I agree tuition is expensive, but that’s another topic about how every state reduced spending on higher education after the 2008 recession.

Instate tuition has increased 400% since my time in Stillwater in the late 90s. Far exceeding inflation.
 

gundysburner

Territorial Marshal
Jul 25, 2018
5,515
1,373
243
51
Boulder, CO
#59
I agree a full scholarship is beneficial, but also comes at a significant price ( of potential physical harm and a significant time sacrifice) and typically most football scholarship athletes Are not able to pursue the entire variety of academic options.

I agree tuition is expensive, but that’s another topic about how every state reduced spending on higher education after the 2008 recession.

Instate tuition has increased 400% since my time in Stillwater in the late 90s. Far exceeding inflation.


Lol, yes, that's pretty much the nature of the agreement both parties willingly enter into.

Don't even get me started on the tuition increase issue, which isn't even addressed in the whole loan forgiveness discussion.:angry:
 

wrenhal

Federal Marshal
Aug 11, 2011
12,977
4,671
1,743
#60
Hard to disagree with this, imo.

https://www.espn.com/college-footba...ella-college-football-playoff-their-own-rules

SCOTTSDALE, Ariz. -- With the collegiate landscape in the midst of sweeping changes and uncertainties, Ohio State athletic director Gene Smith on Tuesday proposed the 10 FBS conferences operate under the umbrella of the College Football Playoff with their own rules and structure while the NCAA continues to host championships for basketball and Olympic sports.

Smith, who said he was "just throwing ideas out" in a brief interview with ESPN at the Big Ten spring meetings, said the schools that offer 85 scholarships "need different rules." He said they could create minimum standards for membership.

"We [can] create our own rules, create our own governance structure, have our own enforcement, we have our own requirements, whatever that might be," Smith said. " ... That might be in the medical space, for example, if a student-athlete is injured and hurt in his or her senior year. You take care of them when they're done until they're healed. And we have the funding in place to do that. You don't touch anything else with the NCAA. You keep the academic requirements in place. The reality is, those schools who offer 85 scholarships in football have made a different commitment and that needs to be addressed."

The CFP model needs to be looked at differently," Smith said. "As we consider expansion, we ought to consider the structure. The reality is we need to begin to control our own space. We've got to make sure we're careful with antitrust, but at the end of the day, we need different rules."

Colorado athletic director Rick George said he's been saying for years that college football needs somebody to oversee the sport in the same way college basketball is run with Dan Gavitt, who is the senior vice president of basketball at the NCAA.
"College football needs the same thing," he said.
But isn't the NCAA, an organization that was setup and is technically overseen by the schools already? I know they've gotten too big, and may need to branch out the different sports, but why are they acting like the NCAA is just some random group that decided to take ownership of the athletic activities of colleges out of nowhere.

Sent from my motorola one 5G using Tapatalk
 
Last edited: