Big 12 to meet to consider 6 new teams(PAC)

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Apr 14, 2009
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For some of us it’s already happened Tooth Dr.
I go out of my way to NOT WATCH any SEC in any sport unless they’re playing my Cowboys. I have for years gone out of my way to not watch Nebraska OU or Texas and Missouri. I literally detest them! I know that the TV gods know what we are watching . So I use my only power to not give the dirtbags any help.
 
Aug 7, 2006
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I certainly hope not, Arkansas has been absolutely pitiful for 20+ years except for last year and maybe a couple other mediocre ones, we are a much better program them
Other than the Chad Morris years I wouldn't say they've been pitiful. They've got a few 10+ win seasons mixed in with some losing seasons. We've definitely been more consistent and a big reason why is they have had 6 head coaches since Gundy has been here.
 
Jul 31, 2004
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The schools that compete for titles need teams they can beat up on. I do not see the BIG or SEC kicking out schools from their conference. They need those wins every year.

Having a conference of only blue bloods, someone has to lose. They may have money but they will begin to lose their brand.

Can we go into another conference and compete for titles? Should we stay and compete but receive less money falling behind other schools? Time will tell.
 
Nov 27, 2007
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I think people seem to be missing the real risk/problem with not being in the B1G or SEC Conference. The risk is that the divide continues to widen. Money, Talent, and Perception will all build on and feed each other. This has a compounding effect with lessening all three for our University. What does averaging 10+ wins a season matter if it gets continually devalued? Meanwhile, that has a compounding impact on the university as a whole too! Like it or not, Football directly affects a University's ability to grow and improve.

Make no mistake here people. There future is VERY uncertain. Not being in the B1G or SEC might end up not mattering very much in 10-20 years. However, that currently seems much less likely. The greater risk is could be HUGELY significant. Imagine a future where our annual media revenue is 1/3rd or even 1/4th what the B1G and SEC, and continuing to get worse. Imagine a future where we go 12-1, but only make an expanded playoff as a 10th seed auto-bid! Imagine a future where the B1G and SEC take almost all the playoff revenue just so others can continue to participate. Imagine a future where the B1G and SEC decide to completely break away from the rest and form their own playoff. All of these are very possible and not being a part of it is a SIGNIFICANT risk. If there is any way to get a seat at the table, OSU should take any action necessary to achieve it.

Well said.



The other issue is that schools outside of the “power conferences” will 100% turn into feeder schools. With an unregulated salary cap (NIL) and free agency (Portal). Here’s exactly what will happen.

The top players in HS will be recruited to the power conferences to:
A. Get best positioned for NFL
B. Get best NIL deal
C. Play for championships

It’s highly unlikely that a school from outside those conferences will be playing for championships consistently if at all.

Players that are not taken directly out of HS into the power conferences will go the G80 schools.

When they excel and show potential will be backdoor recruited to a power conference schools so that they can get “ABC” as well.

Would Breece Hall have stayed at ISU if Ohio State offered him 100k to come to Columbus and compete for championships?
 
Jul 9, 2011
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Yes. If that was our conference, I would expect us to average 9-3 seasons. Sometimes it would be 8-4 or even 7-5, but those would be limited. I also expect we would catch lightning in a bottle every once in a while and win 10 or 11 games.

Gundy has averaged a 67% win percentage since 2009, and about 65% over the last 10 years. Even if I'm slightly agressive on my numbers, to say that we go .500 is asinine and gives way to much credit to mediocre sec teams.
It's not so "asinine". You could just say you disagree. Remember, I said .500 or better. Our winning percent over the last 10 years rounds to 70% even. AND if we had played an SEC type schedule with 4 non-conference games per season, we would have one more non-conference easy win game per season, which would push us up to more like a 75-80% win total over the past 10 years.

Assume we would be in the West division, so we would play Bama every year but not Georgia. Once you get passed those top two, we'd be fine. Divisions within conferences means you don't have to play all the best teams in the conference every year and one you have one more non-conference game. And SEC teams schedule non-conference opponents just like we do: 1 competitive opponent and 3 tin cans. That is a big advantage toward padding your winning percentage each year while associating with top teams in the conference. If you want wins, the Big 12 needs to go to the division format with another non-conference game like the SEC.

These SEC West teams really scare you?? Get passed the helmet decals and look at their records. Bama was really good, but I think we would have battled with Kentucky for 2nd in the West.

Tennessee 4-6 in 2021 (net of 3 easy non-conference wins)
S Carolina 4-6
Missouri 3-7
Florida 3-7
Vanderbilt 0-10
 
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ouflak

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Nov 7, 2009
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For some of us it’s already happened Tooth Dr.
I go out of my way to NOT WATCH any SEC in any sport unless they’re playing my Cowboys. I have for years gone out of my way to not watch Nebraska OU or Texas and Missouri. I literally detest them! I know that the TV gods know what we are watching . So I use my only power to not give the dirtbags any help.
I will still watch Big XII games of note, even after we've gone. Especially OSU as there is just so much history between us, and I still (maybe naively) believe we will have a fixed game every season. However, despite how much interest I have in the subject of Conference Realignment, I just don't - perhaps surprisingly - hold any grudges against any schools. If teams were jumping around for purely emotional reasons instead of chasing cold hard cash, I might feel differently. I do think some individuals, some schools, and a few conferences from time-to-time have acted with poor ethics and astonishing incompetence in certain moments. And the athletic admin CEO's certainly and obviously have a cruel disregard for us fans. The whole lot as far as I can tell. But this is the nature of the beast since the legal case that moved control of the media contracts from the NCAA to the schools/conferences went through.

If I were to stop watching teams that have taken actions for money since that event: the collapse of the SWC, the formation of the Big XII, the vultures picking apart the Big East - even before it was dead, PAC expansion, founding Big 8/XII/ACC teams running off in the night, the subsequent moves by the SEC and B1G, not to mention all of the butchery cut-throat drama that has occured in the non-P5 conferences, well... I don't think I'd be watching any college football teams - even the team I grew up watching.

No. Just put the scheduled opposing teams in front us, and let's play. I'll try and enjoy the game for as long as I reasonably (glaring at you ESPN) can. Not sure how much longer that will be..., but hopefully for a couple of more decades would be nice.
 
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gundysburner

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Jul 25, 2018
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Good read on the predicament the PAC12 commish is in. Really makes you wonder what would have happened if the PAC12 had made a strong play for the Pokes and others last summer when OU & Texas left. Hard to look back and not think that the SEC & B1G simply beat the other conferences to the punch with this round of expansion. Also shows how an 'outsider' had no apparent clue what was coming, or the climate he was entering.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/spor...ve-league-college-sports-changes/10186859002/
 

gundysburner

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Jul 25, 2018
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Long, but interesting piece from ESPN on what the future landscape of college football could look like. I don't like their concept of starting the season with bowl games-just think it'd favor the bluebloods even more. I do like some of the timelines on coaching interviews, deadline for entering the draft, etc... Something's going to have to give on the NIL & Transfer situation.

https://www.espn.com/college-footba...-season-reimagining-college-football-calendar
 

OSUCowboy787

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Dec 31, 2008
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Long, but interesting piece from ESPN on what the future landscape of college football could look like. I don't like their concept of starting the season with bowl games-just think it'd favor the bluebloods even more. I do like some of the timelines on coaching interviews, deadline for entering the draft, etc... Something's going to have to give on the NIL & Transfer situation.

https://www.espn.com/college-footba...-season-reimagining-college-football-calendar
I think this thing is going to pendulum back pretty hard eventually. Lets say the SEC and B1G get all the blue bloods right? Well why and or how would a team be considered a 'blue blood' if they never win anymore and aren't even really competitive? Looking at Clemson, FSU, OU, Texas, UCLA, USC, Auburn etc etc etc. I think its pretty obvious that Nebraska has lost 'blue blood' status being in the B1G and will likely only fall further to obscurity in the future. Knowing that, I could see several of the non competitive 'blue bloods' eventually looking for an exit back to their old conferences or regions where they could likely and in their mind hopefully become consistent winners again. Of course they won't admit that the reason is to become relevant again but a decade or so of not even sniffing a championship in football may make the money a non factor, especially for those teams already leading the revenue race like Texas.
 

gundysburner

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Jul 25, 2018
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I think this thing is going to pendulum back pretty hard eventually. Lets say the SEC and B1G get all the blue bloods right? Well why and or how would a team be considered a 'blue blood' if they never win anymore and aren't even really competitive? Looking at Clemson, FSU, OU, Texas, UCLA, USC, Auburn etc etc etc. I think its pretty obvious that Nebraska has lost 'blue blood' status being in the B1G and will likely only fall further to obscurity in the future. Knowing that, I could see several of the non competitive 'blue bloods' eventually looking for an exit back to their old conferences or regions where they could likely and in their mind hopefully become consistent winners again. Of course they won't admit that the reason is to become relevant again but a decade or so of not even sniffing a championship in football may make the money a non factor, especially for those teams already leading the revenue race like Texas.
What you're proposing would mean walking away from tens of millions. I don't see that happening, but anymore, who knows?:innocent:
 

gundysburner

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Jul 25, 2018
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https://www.yahoo.com/news/bohls-finally-expanded-cfp-field-110101824.html

Shoe's on the other foot. The Pac-12 got its hackles up when the Big 12 boldly (if presumptuously) said it was “open for business” at its media days and new commissioner Brett Yormark, who officially took office on Monday, said the Big 12 was all-in. Well, support for a merger between his league and the Pac-12 quickly saw some roadblocks, maybe in part because Pac-12 Commissioner George Kliavkoff didn’t want to lose his job. But he wrongly said the Big 12 was trying to “de-stabilize” the Pac-12. Guess what, George. Consider your league already de-stabilized. And study your history because your friends in the Big Ten did it first and it should be noted that the Pac-12 de-stabilized the Big 12 first by wresting away Colorado and also trying to lure six teams, including Texas and OU, westward.

Transfer trauma. The NCAA's transformation committee made a recommendation that would allow all college athletes to transfer as many times as they wish without being penalized. That’s a bad idea because the rule needs some guardrails, just as name, image, likeness and new world collegiate athletics do. Unlimited transfers will just be too enticing for these young men and women and those who influence their decisions. However, Division I officials are expected to vote against the proposal, so that’s a positive.
 

OSUCowboy787

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Dec 31, 2008
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What you're proposing would mean walking away from tens of millions. I don't see that happening, but anymore, who knows?:innocent:
Honestly it may not be turning away from money in a decades time depending on how the playoff qualifiers turn out. I look at ou for example, I truly believe up to 60% of their fans would bail to another team, possibly OSU, if they were not in any way consistent or vying for a conference title or national title. There are countless T-Shirt fans for all blue bloods that will follow any near local team that happens to be winning. The question you have to ask is how do you secure the regular T-Shirt fan viewer to watch your team (bring in viewership and dollars). Not saying anyone wants a fair weather fan but thats just the nature of the beast. I believe our advantage is staying in the Big 12 for OSU and being competitive year in and year out and winning the conference crown on a somewhat consistent basis while going to the playoffs and hopefully making some noise there too.
 

gundysburner

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Jul 25, 2018
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Honestly it may not be turning away from money in a decades time depending on how the playoff qualifiers turn out. I look at ou for example, I truly believe up to 60% of their fans would bail to another team, possibly OSU, if they were not in any way consistent or vying for a conference title or national title. There are countless T-Shirt fans for all blue bloods that will follow any near local team that happens to be winning. The question you have to ask is how do you secure the regular T-Shirt fan viewer to watch your team (bring in viewership and dollars). Not saying anyone wants a fair weather fan but thats just the nature of the beast. I believe our advantage is staying in the Big 12 for OSU and being competitive year in and year out and winning the conference crown on a somewhat consistent basis while going to the playoffs and hopefully making some noise there too.
Not sure what you mean by the first sentence. Why & how would it 'not be turning away from money'?

Your 60% prediction is orange kool-aid.
 
Jul 31, 2008
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Honestly it may not be turning away from money in a decades time depending on how the playoff qualifiers turn out. I look at ou for example, I truly believe up to 60% of their fans would bail to another team, possibly OSU, if they were not in any way consistent or vying for a conference title or national title. There are countless T-Shirt fans for all blue bloods that will follow any near local team that happens to be winning. The question you have to ask is how do you secure the regular T-Shirt fan viewer to watch your team (bring in viewership and dollars). Not saying anyone wants a fair weather fan but thats just the nature of the beast. I believe our advantage is staying in the Big 12 for OSU and being competitive year in and year out and winning the conference crown on a somewhat consistent basis while going to the playoffs and hopefully making some noise there too.
I never watched Boise State or TCU (when in Mountain West) just because they won a bunch of games.
Not sure fans will switch like you are suggesting.
 

OSUCowboy787

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Not sure what you mean by the first sentence. Why & how would it 'not be turning away from money'?

Your 60% prediction is orange kool-aid.
If the Big 12 can start to demand more money from networks because we are able to gain the casual fan from the teams who used to be 'good'

I never watched Boise State or TCU (when in Mountain West) just because they won a bunch of games.
Not sure fans will switch like you are suggesting.
Boise and TCU were not in a top 3 conference