Warren's Plan on Student Loans

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Jul 25, 2018
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#1
https://finance.yahoo.com/news/warren-student-loans-121342487.html?.tsrc=notification-brknews

Interesting proposal from Elizabeth Warren to cancel student loan debts, or at least portions of them.

I'm a little conflicted about it, but I think the idea has some merit.

One of the things that's dramatically different from when I was in school in the early 90's is the sheer amount of loan money available to kids today. I look back & I'm actually thankful that I wasn't able to borrow as much as they can today, because I'd owe more than I already do. So I didn't graduate with near the debt that alot of kids have today.

Couple that with serious increases in cost to attend college & there are plenty of kids graduating with serious, serious debt in their mid-twenties. Thoughts of buying a home or starting to invest in retirement are pipe dreams for alot of them.

So I don't know if her plan is necessarily the answer, but I think it oughta be at least a starting point for a discussion.
 

CocoCincinnati

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#2
Buying votes pure and simple. I paid off every cent of my student loans. It wasn't easy, heck I didn't even have cable for the first two years out of college, but I eventually got it done. If we want to teach kids and young adults that there are no consequences for borrowing money, then guess what they are going to do as soon as that student loan debt is wiped clean.
 

CocoCincinnati

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#3
I will add about Warren though that at least she's willing to put policy ideas out there for us to debate. As much as I disagree with her I applaud that. The rest of the empty suits seem content to run solely on rhetoric alone.
 

Bowers2

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#5
Cancelling some people's debt is actually not a bad idea. What is a bad idea is making college free. There's so much more that can be done (i.e. reducing administrative costs) to make college affordable for everyone again.
 
Jul 25, 2018
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#6
Buying votes pure and simple. I paid off every cent of my student loans. It wasn't easy, heck I didn't even have cable for the first two years out of college, but I eventually got it done. If we want to teach kids and young adults that there are no consequences for borrowing money, then guess what they are going to do as soon as that student loan debt is wiped clean.
I see that side of it, & generally agree with you.

I think there's a larger discussion, though, about the amount of debt kids today face. Higher ed costs have gotten ridiculous, & for middle class families like ours, there's almost no grant $$ or the like, it's either pay it out of pocket or go the loan route. This is not at all how it was when I grew up in a middle class home & went to school. My PELL grants went a helluva long way each semester. I was stunned when we started the process for our daughter 4 years ago & we found out that basically, we couldn't qualify for anything but loans.

Part of this discussion needs to be, imo, the rising costs implemented by universities, specifically the rising costs of fees imposed, as opposed to just tuition. Arcane policies like requiring freshman to live on campus, & buy meal plans is ridiculous, imo. I went through this 30 years ago at OSU, for instance, where they were insistent I had to live on campus. Well, I lived with my parents, & they had to fight OSU & jump through hoops so that I didn't have to have those expenses.

With over 44 million borrowers, over 10 million in deferrment, forebearance, default, & $1.5 trillion of debt, I think it's worth looking at & saying what can we do to limit the debt facing young graduates, so that they have some economically mobility in early adult life & have the ability to start smart financial goals, that's all.
 
Jul 25, 2018
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#7
Cancelling some people's debt is actually not a bad idea. What is a bad idea is making college free. There's so much more that can be done (i.e. reducing administrative costs) to make college affordable for everyone again.
Exactly.

Not calling for free education, but reducing costs, & even reducing what's available for students to borrow.
 

Bowers2

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#8
Exactly.

Not calling for free education, but reducing costs, & even reducing what's available for students to borrow.
Costs are up something like 6000% since 1975. No one in Washington will, but we need to first look at WHY this has happened and do things to correct it.
 

oks10

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#9
I agree this is much more acceptable way of reducing student debt IMO. I'd like to know where she how she set her dollar values, but overall the idea of forgiving a limited amount of debt and that limit being lowered as your income gets higher isn't a terrible idea. I also agree with Bowers that we've GOT to look at what the heck has driven costs up so high to begin with though. It's not like that insane increase in the cost of college makes that piece of paper you get in the end worth any more...
 

Donnyboy

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#10
Costs are up something like 6000% since 1975. No one in Washington will, but we need to first look at WHY this has happened and do things to correct it.
It happened because of federal aid and loans......schools used to have to stay priced low enough to fill the campuses. Open the money spigot and everyone can go so they jack the prices up and start requiring bullshit classes and creating bullshit majors.....want to be an engineer.....well you need 6 hours of humanities, 6 hours of PE, and a class with an international emphasis. That will be 5K please.
 

Bowers2

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It happened because of federal aid and loans......schools used to have to stay priced low enough to fill the campuses. Open the money spigot and everyone can go so they jack the prices up and start requiring bullshit classes and creating bullshit majors.....want to be an engineer.....well you need 6 hours of humanities, 6 hours of PE, and a class with an international emphasis. That will be 5K please.
Absolutely that's part of it, but I think saying it's only that is too simplistic. Like the other poster brought up, requiring students to do this or that, administrative costs, yada yada yada. There are a ton of things that go into it.
 
Jul 25, 2018
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#12
I agree this is much more acceptable way of reducing student debt IMO. I'd like to know where she how she set her dollar values, but overall the idea of forgiving a limited amount of debt and that limit being lowered as your income gets higher isn't a terrible idea. I also agree with Bowers that we've GOT to look at what the heck has driven costs up so high to begin with though. It's not like that insane increase in the cost of college makes that piece of paper you get in the end worth any more...
A friend of mine is a History Professor at OU, who now teaches multiple classes online. He'll tell you straight up that Universities are so built on traditional students, that they've been reluctantly slow to adopt online options & that the costs for those are absurd. He literally grades an assignment a week, has no lecture time, & the students simply follow an online syllabus, which doesn't even change for years at a time. No video lectures, just the student & the text, & papers they submit online. This was my experience taking classes online a few years back to work on a master's.

Another friend, who's very high up in OSU's administration, & I used to go round & round about education changing. He's just simply old school & wants as many students on campus as they can get, & he would knock the online option, talk about "the college experience, etc..." I was looking at changing careers at the time, & ultimately decided that a career in the medical field was what I wanted, so I started my climb at a CareerTech program. He couldn't believe it, but I told him "look, I can literally spend around $6k & graduate with pretty much a guaranteed job, with room to grow. I did that, went on to an advanced program through CareerTech for literally $1800, jumped another rung on the career ladder & I'm happy to say that it's afforded me things I didn't think I'd ever had.

It's another thread, but it really irks me that we downplay the trades & other non-university options for our kids. There are some great careers out there that don't require big debt to be a part of. Additionally, Oklahoma's blessed with a tremendous CareerTech program across the state that kids can take advantage of. Hell, my sister graduated from High School & CareerTech the same year, had a career already & owned her own cosmetology business by 24.
 
Aug 16, 2012
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#13
I have been out of school for 29 years now and I STILL have student loan debt that will not be paid off for a few more months. Quite frankly, mine was not all that high if I recall, something like $50K. Since I could not just automatically be an architect, I was able to forebear repayment until I got my license so that delayed repayment for five years while interest racked up and I think it topped out around $75K. Graduated payments originally something like $100/month with increases each year. I have a hard time feeling sorry for anyone who borrows money and wants it to be absolved because it is too difficult to pay back.

TWENTY-NINE YEARS!!!!!!

Have no pity for anyone in this regard. You borrow money? Buck up and pay it off.

Oh, and that repayment period? Also included bankruptcy about 10 years out of school as well coupled with unemployment for a period right about then also. There is nothing anyone can say to convince me it cannot be done. It is hard work, takes a lot of time and sacrifice.
 
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Jul 25, 2018
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#14
Absolutely that's part of it, but I think saying it's only that is too simplistic. Like the other poster brought up, requiring students to do this or that, administrative costs, yada yada yada. There are a ton of things that go into it.
Exactly, there's not just one component to this, but rising required costs & the amounts of loan money available are big ones.
 

RxCowboy

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#15

RxCowboy

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#16
I have been out of school for 29 years now and I STILL have student loan debt that will not be paid off for a few more months. Quite frankly, mine was not all that high if I recall, something like $50K. Since I could not just automatically be an architect, I was able to forebear repayment until I got my license so that delayed repayment for five years while interest racked up and I think it topped out around $75K. Graduated payments originally something like $100/month with increases each year. I have a hard time feeling sorry for anyone who borrows money and wants it to be absolved because it is too difficult to pay back.

TWENTY-NINE YEARS!!!!!!

Have no pity for anyone in this regard. You borrow money? Buck up and pay it off.
I paid off my loans in 2014. I graduated with my BS in 1988.
 
Jul 10, 2009
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#17
You also have to look at the way government has instituted huge administrative burdens on colleges and university. Maybe I was clueless when I was at OSU almost 40 years ago, but I don't remember departments of diversity, Title IX compliance (not athletic), student success, marketing, mental health services, etc. Imagine the cost of technology and support. It would be interesting to know what departments had no counterpart at all a few decades back.
 
Aug 16, 2012
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#20
I paid off my loans in 2014. I graduated with my BS in 1988.
To my point. You made a commitment and saw it through. I will be right about the same as you when I am done.
Everyone has decisions to make and if someone is in debt, it is nobody's fault but their own. It is called accountability. Why should I bail you out? Who bailed me out the past 30 years?