Trump eyeing executive order to end citizenship for children born in U.S. to non-citizens

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CowboyOrangeFan

Mmmm, yeah.
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#43
Let me help you out. That is not the important part of the sentence. In addition, there are commas in the sentence. Some people don't seem to understand that commas separate one part of a sentence from another, or one item in a list from the other items in the list. The part of the sentence you highlighted specifically declares that persons born in the U.S. who are the children of foreign dignitaries serving in the U.S. are not to be considered citizens upon birth. That's not the issue under discussion. Furthermore, that clause does not preclude the earlier part of the sentence from meaning the same. "This will not, of course, include persons born in the United States who are foreigners, aliens, . . ." Currently, the children of these latter two groups are being granted citizenship upon birth on U.S. soil.
Let me help you out. The whole list pertains to the last part. That is what is meant and that is how it has been interpreted over the years. You can't just stop at mid sentence and say all foreigners or a!iens. If it was meant to be interpreted the way you suggest, then their would be an "or" before the last item on the list. There isn't.
 
Jul 7, 2004
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The Island Where Chinese Mothers Deliver American Babies

Jon Emont, Nancy Borowick




© Nancy Borowick for The Wall Street JournalSAIPAN, Northern Mariana Islands—This U.S. territory in the western Pacific is known for its epic World War II battle, white-sand beaches and the enduring culture of its indigenous Chamorro people.
But for a certain class of Chinese parents, Saipan has become known as the latest hot spot for birth tourism, a place where women can give birth to babies who will automatically acquire U.S. citizenship.

The Northern Marianas, an island chain that includes Saipan, is the only U.S. soil that Chinese can visit without a visa, after a change in immigration policy in 2009 allowed Chinese and Russian tourists visa-free entry for up to 45 days.
“It’s just like if God opened a window for you,” said a Chinese father who works as a translator here after coming a few years ago to ensure his child would be born American.
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The Northern Marianas pressed for the visa waiver to support an economy reliant on tourism, notably to Saipan’s casinos and gambling parlors. The number of Chinese visitors has risen substantially since 2009 and now represents 36% of tourists to the island, which is four to five hours’ flight from Shanghai and Guangzhou. Tourism accounts for 72% of Saipan’s economy.
The number of American babies born here to Chinese women who entered as tourists also climbed—to 472 last year from eight in 2009—according to the Northern Marianas government. Last year, for the first time, more Chinese tourists gave birth here than Americans.
“As long as you have birthright citizenship, it’s true this is something that can be exploited,” said Doris Meissner, former commissioner of the U.S. Immigration and Naturalization Service and senior fellow at the Migration Policy Institute. “This is the first I’ve heard of Saipan,” she said. “That’s actually quite clever.”
U.S. authorities don’t have a tally of how many people come to the U.S. each year to gain birthright citizenship. An association of Chinese birth-tour operators estimated that 10,000 Chinese birth tourists came to the U.S. in 2012.
Chinese travel businesses offer competing packages to help Chinese mothers reach U.S. soil and provide them with lodging, hospital care and domestic help.
There is nothing illegal about birth tourism, provided the visitor has the funds to pay for required medical procedures and doesn’t intend to overstay, said Jaime Ruiz, a spokesman for U.S. Customs and Border Protection.
In 2015, when U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement raided nearly 40 locations tied to birth-tourism operations in Southern California, the search warrants cited suspected visa fraud, tax evasion and harboring illegal immigrants, among other charges. The related cases are ongoing, ICE said.
The translator in Saipan said immigration enforcement on the U.S. mainland had led more Chinese parents to consider Saipan. While birth-tourism packages to Los Angeles included guidance on how to qualify for a tourist visa, Chinese travelers to Saipan needn’t clear that hurdle.
American obstetrician Claire Grove said that when she came to work at a clinic on Saipan last year, she was surprised at how many Chinese women had come to the island to give birth.
She soon had a unique perspective on birth tourism.
Dr. Grove learned that Sen Sun, a translator, was running a business to help Chinese mothers deliver on Saipan. Concerned about what she believed to be Mr. Sun’s exploitation of illegal Chinese workers, Dr. Grove went to the Federal Bureau of Investigation.
As a result of an FBI probe, the U.S. Attorney’s office in the Northern Marianas prosecuted Mr. Sun, leading to his Dec. 8 guilty plea of harboring illegal aliens in relation to his hiring of Chinese maids to care for birth tourists.
“They feel trapped without U.S. citizenship,” Dr. Grove said of the maids. “They have no means to complain about not being paid or anything.”
In his plea deal, Mr. Sun said he operated “an unregistered and therefore illegal business operation arranging travel, medical, and other services to pregnant foreign citizens,” in which he charged women more than $15,000 each, before hospital bills. Sentencing is set for March.
The U.S. Attorney’s Office declined to comment on the case against Mr. Sun, whose lawyer declined to comment on the case and on Dr. Grove’s accusation that Mr. Sun exploited his staff.
In China, websites advertising birth-tourism packages abound, with names such as GlobalBaby8.com, promising luxurious birth vacations to Saipan. The Chinese translator whose wife gave birth on Saipan said total costs can exceed $50,000.
“Everyone is feeling unsafe in China,” the father said, citing among other things the political crackdown under President Xi Jinping. “We will do anything for our kids.” The father still lives on Saipan with his wife and children, and fears they will be deported.
Recently in the obstetrics unit at Saipan’s main hospital, a pregnant Chinese woman walked down a hall in a hospital gown and pink slippers, trailed by her translator, past a painting of Chamorro warriors dueling in loincloths.
Doctors and administrators said the surge in the number of Chinese mothers is overwhelming health facilities. “It’s a strain for the community,” said Esther Muna, CEO of government health provider Commonwealth Healthcare Corporation, which runs the hospital.
Ms. Muna said Chinese women in late stages of pregnancy presented difficulties when doctors didn’t know their medical history. In October, a Chinese mother died in childbirth on the island.
Saipan is leaving it to federal authorities to chase down immigration violators. The Justice Department in April said it was cracking down on immigration violations in the Northern Marianas, after the conviction of a Taiwan national for harboring a Chinese birth tourist who had overstayed.
“Federal and local authorities should know where birth tourists are being housed and should be able to identify overstayers,” said Gregorio Sablan, the Northern Marianas’ congressional representative. “Cutting off visa-free travel to the Marianas for hundreds of thousands of visitors from China in order to prevent a few hundred birth tourists makes no sense from a business point of view.
 
Jul 7, 2004
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Birth tourism brings Russian baby boom to Miami



Jan. 9, 2018 / 4:49 PM CST / Updated Jan. 10, 2018 / 9:38 AM CST
By Cynthia McFadden, Sarah Fitzpatrick, Tracy Connor and Anna Schecter
MIAMI — Lured by the charm of little Havana or the glamour of South Beach, some 15 million tourists visit Miami every year.
But for a growing number of Russian women, the draw isn't sunny beaches or pulsing nightclubs. It's U.S. citizenship for their newborn children.


In Moscow, it's a status symbol to have a Miami-born baby, and social media is full of Russian women boasting of their little americantsy.





Why Russian mothers-to-be are rushing to Florida to give birth
JAN. 10, 201804:15

"It's really common," said Ekaterina Kuznetsova, 29. "When I was taking the plane to come here, it was not only me. It was four or five women flying here."
Ekaterina was one of dozens of Russian birth tourists NBC News spoke to over the past four months about a round-trip journey that costs tens of thousands of dollars and takes them away from home for weeks or months.
Why do they come?

"American passport is a big plus for the baby. Why not?" Olesia Reshetova, 31, told NBC News.
"And the doctors, the level of education," Kuznetsova added.
The weather doesn't hurt, either.
"It's a very comfortable place for staying in wintertime," Oleysa Suhareva said.
Oleysa Suhareva traveled from Russia to Miami to give birth.Courtesy Oleysa Suhareva
It's not just the Russians who are coming. Chinese moms-to-be have been flocking to Southern California to give birth for years.

What they are doing is completely legal, as long as they don't lie on any immigration or insurance paperwork. In fact, it's protected by the 14th amendment to the U.S. Constitution, which says anyone born on American soil is automatically a citizen.
The child gets a lifelong right to live and work and collect benefits in the U.S. And when they turn 21 they can sponsor their parents' application for an American green card.
As president, Donald Trump has indicated he is opposed to so-called chain migration, which gives U.S. citizens the right to sponsor relatives, because of recent terror attacks. And as a candidate, he called for an end to birthright citizenship, declaring it in one of his first policy papers the "biggest magnet for illegal immigration."
"You have to get rid of it," he said on "Meet the Press" on NBC. "They're having a baby and all of a sudden — nobody knows — the baby is here. You have no choice."

In a twist, as the Daily Beast first reported, condo buildings that bear the Trump name are the most popular for the out-of-town obstetric patients, although the units are subleased from the individual owners and it's not clear if building management is aware.
There is no indication that Trump or the Trump Organization is profiting directly from birth tourism; the company and the White House did not respond to requests for comment.
Roman Bokeria, the state director of the Florida Association of Realtors told NBC News that Trump- branded buildings in the Sunny Isles Beach area north of Miami are particularly popular with the Russian birth tourists and Russian immigrants.
"Sunny Isles beach has a nickname — Little Russia — because people who are moving from Russian-speaking countries to America, they want … a familiar environment."

"They go across the street, they have Russian market, Russian doctor, Russian lawyer," he added. "It's very comfortable for them."
Oleysa Suhareva's baby became an American citizen by being born in Miami.Courtesy Oleysa Suhareva
Reshetova came to Miami to have her first child, hiring an agency to help arrange her trip. The services — which can include finding apartments and doctors and obtaining visas — don't come cheap. She expects to pay close to $50,000, and some packages run as high as $100,000. Bokeria says some landlords ask for six months rent up front.





One firm, Miami Mama, says it brings about 100 Russian and Russian-speaking clients to the U.S. per year, 30 percent of them repeat clients. The owners are Irina and Konstantin Lubnevskiy, who bought Miami Mama after using the firm to have two American children themselves.

The couple says they counsel clients to be completely transparent with U.S. immigration officials that they're expecting.
"We tell every client, 'You have the documents, you have to tell the truth. This is America. They like the truth here,'" Konstantin said.
"I would like the American people to understand they don't have to worry," he added. "Those who come here want to become part of the American people."
But Miami Mami has drawn scrutiny from law enforcement. In June, it was raided by the FBI, and an employee was convicted of making false statements on passport applications. The owners say they knew nothing about it, fired the worker and their business license was renewed.

Federal prosecutors declined to comment on the case, and the FBI said it could not discuss "an active investigation."
There is no official data on birth tourism in the United States. The Center for Immigration Studies, which wants stricter limits on immigration, estimates there are 36,000 babies born in the U.S. to foreign nationals a year, though the numbers could be substantially lower. Florida says births in the state by all foreign nationals who live outside the United States have jumped 200 percent since 2000.
Customs and Border Protection says there are no laws governing whether pregnant foreign nationals can enter the country or give birth here.
"However, if a pregnant woman or anyone else uses fraud or deception to obtain a visa or gain admission to the United States, that would constitute a criminal act," the agency said.

When federal agents raided California "maternity hotels" catering to Chinese clients in 2015, authorities said in court papers that some of the families falsely claimed they were indigent and got reduced hospital rates.
In Miami, the Jackson Health System said 72 percent of international maternity patients — who represented 8 percent of all patients giving birth last year — pay with insurance or through a pre-arranged package.
Reshetova said she understands the concerns some have about birth tourism, because it's also an issue in Russia.
"But I pay by myself," she said. "I pay with my money, bring it here to America. I'm not going to take something to America.

"I don't know what my daughter will choose in future. But if I can spend money — my money — for her choice, why not?"
 
Jul 20, 2018
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#46
The time has come to finally confront birthright citizenship for babies of illegals and other non-citizens. Trump issuing an Executive Order won't change the currently used "interpretation" of the practice as there is a long line of judges ready to block practically anything he puts forth regarding immigration. But....... SCOTUS can! Whether they will remains to be seen.

This E.O., if issued will be for starting the process of such a court challenge. It's simply the first and easiest Avenue to the Administration's desired outcome.

Time will tell, but I applaud the efforts to bring this practice which so arguably harms our nation to a test.
 

NotOnTV

BRB -- Taking an okie leak
Sep 14, 2010
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#47
I sure am glad the Dims are now pre-occupied with the Constitution being that a strict constitutionalist was just appointed to the Supreme Court.
 

CaliforniaCowboy

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#48
Gonna be tough for him to get an EO upheld that is in direct conflict of the 14th Amendment Anyone who supports a POTUS thinking they can over ride the Constitution via EO is a moron regardless of who the POTUS is.....Trump is developing a severe case of the Obamaitis

Article 14 section 1 of he US Constitution
All persons born or naturalized in the United States and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.

It would require a constitutional amendment to change birthright citizenship and nothing less
It does NOT require a "constitutional amendment", because you are misreading what the 14th actually says (not including the fact that it was written exclusively to address to freed slaves and their offspring).

It says: "and subject to the jurisdiction thereof". Foreigners are not citizens and are therefore not "subject to the jurisdiction thereof". They are subject to the jurisdiction of their native countries.

The Supreme Beings misinterpreted the 14th to get the ruling that we now have, and the Supreme Beings can over-ride their prior erroneous ruling - without an amendment.

United States v. Wong Kim Ark, 169 U.S. 649 (1898), is a United States Supreme Court case in which the Court ruled 6–2 that a child born in the United States, of parents of Chinese nationality who at the time had a permanent domicile and residence in the United States and were carrying on business there but not as employees of the Chinese government, automatically became a U.S. citizen. This decision established an important precedent in its interpretation of the Citizenship Clause of the Fourteenth Amendment to the Constitution.

The Wong Kim Ark ruling only dealt with LEGAL immigrants.

There is currently no law, ruling nor constitutional basis for anchor babies by Illegals or foreigners that do not have some legal standing.
 
Nov 23, 2010
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#49
It does NOT require a "constitutional amendment", because you are misreading what the 14th actually says (not including the fact that it was written exclusively to address to freed slaves and their offspring).
If this is the case why were opponents concerned about Gypsies and Chinese? "Cowan objected especially to granting birthright citizenship to the children of aliens who “owe [the U.S.] no allegiance [and] who pretend to owe none,” and to those who regularly commit “trespass” within the U.S."

In response, proponents agreed with this interpretation, "The proposition before us … relates simply in that respect to the children begotten of Chinese parents in California, and it is proposed to declare that they shall be citizens. … I am in favor of doing so. … We are entirely ready to accept the provision proposed in this constitutional amendment, that the children born here of Mongolian parents shall be declared by the Constitution of the United States to be entitled to civil rights and to equal protection before the law with others."

I don't see how this debate about the amendment can conclude that it was only to apply to freed slaves and their offspring.

It says: "and subject to the jurisdiction thereof". Foreigners are not citizens and are therefore not "subject to the jurisdiction thereof". They are subject to the jurisdiction of their native countries.
If illegal aliens are not subject to the jurisdiction of the US, how do we obtain a judgment against them for any crime?

I'll link this again because it seems pretty persuasive on the subject, from a Trump appointee.
 

CaliforniaCowboy

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#50
If illegal aliens are not subject to the jurisdiction of the US, how do we obtain a judgment against them for any crime?

I'll link this again because it seems pretty persuasive on the subject, from a Trump appointee.
Jurisdiction, in this context, does not mean that you are not required to follow laws. The Illegals REJECTED jurisdiction by breaking the laws and entering illegally. There is really no other way to look at it.

as for the link.... I got this far and stopped readying as it appears to be ridiculously flawed.

We begin, of course, with the text of the Citizenship Clause. To be “subject to the jurisdiction” of the U.S. is simply to be subject to the authority of the U.S. government.8 The phrase thus covers the vast majority of persons within our borders who are required to obey U.S. laws. And obedience, of course, does not turn on immigration status, national allegiance, or past compliance. All must obey.
 
Nov 23, 2010
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Jurisdiction, in this context, does not mean that you are not required to follow laws. The Illegals REJECTED jurisdiction by breaking the laws and entering illegally. There is really no other way to look at it.

as for the link.... I got this far and stopped readying as it appears to be ridiculously flawed.

We begin, of course, with the text of the Citizenship Clause. To be “subject to the jurisdiction” of the U.S. is simply to be subject to the authority of the U.S. government.8 The phrase thus covers the vast majority of persons within our borders who are required to obey U.S. laws. And obedience, of course, does not turn on immigration status, national allegiance, or past compliance. All must obey.
Do you have any supporting authorities for your interpretation over his? I would enjoy reading them.
 

CaliforniaCowboy

Federal Marshal
Oct 15, 2003
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#52
I don't see how this debate about the amendment can conclude that it was only to apply to freed slaves and their offspring.
... (in the Wong case) the court is assuming what Congress may have intended while also arguing the written debates that could easily disclose this intent is inadmissible as evidence. This has to be one of the most incompetent and feeble rulings ever handed down by the Supreme Court.
 
Nov 23, 2010
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... (in the Wong case) the court is assuming what Congress may have intended while also arguing the written debates that could easily disclose this intent is inadmissible as evidence. This has to be one of the most incompetent and feeble rulings ever handed down by the Supreme Court.
Feel free to disclose here.
 

CaliforniaCowboy

Federal Marshal
Oct 15, 2003
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Feel free to disclose here.
it is self disclosing..... the court ignored the intent of the bill's author (even though available), and instead used their own interpretation - which is pretty much the whole current debate about originalists or "textists" that is ongoing with current Supreme Being nominations.
 

GumbyFromPokeyLand

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#57
Gonna be tough for him to get an EO upheld that is in direct conflict of the 14th Amendment Anyone who supports a POTUS thinking they can over ride the Constitution via EO is a moron regardless of who the POTUS is.....Trump is developing a severe case of the Obamaitis

Article 14 section 1 of he US Constitution
All persons born or naturalized in the United States and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.

It would require a constitutional amendment to change birthright citizenship and nothing less
I think your missing the meaning of “subject to the jurisdiction thereof”. Subject to the jurisdiction thereof is a qualifier as to which persons born in the US are therefore citizens. Any person born to persons that are not subject to the jurisdiction thereof are not therefore citizens. Hearings and debate at the time regarding jurisdiction clearly indicate non-citizens are not subject to the jurisdiction thereof.


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