The Bernie "That wasn't real soclialism" thread

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Bowers2

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When people willfully ignore the difference between inalienable and citizenship rights to allow non citizens the ability to participate in citizenship rights it's mind numbing.
I'm actually all for having to show an ID to vote. But I also like messing with you guys and you absolutely are calling for more government regs.
 

Well

still making mistakes
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Hey I just think it's funny when "conservatives" call for more government selectively. You know what would really work? If at birth we all got bar codes tattooed on our wrists that we could scan at the voting booth. Be careful what you wish for. You know the government don't stop.
Won't be bar codes, but micro-chips. The dog experiment is working pretty good.
 

steross

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I was going to compare gun licenses to voting ID's, but then realized people don't think carrying a gun should even require a license. I love when "conservatives" pick and choose Constitutional rights.
Freedom!!!!!!!! Protect our rights as law abiding citizens!!!!! Our forefathers formed a constitutional republic not some big European nanny state!!!!

Oh, wait a minute on all that. I believe there is a hyphen in your name on this card but not that one. Even though every other piece of information matches identically, that hyphen is critical. So, no freedom for you. Freedom and all that stuff is kinda important in this country but not nearly as important as perfectly matching documentation.
 

Deere Poke

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Freedom!!!!!!!! Protect our rights as law abiding citizens!!!!! Our forefathers formed a constitutional republic not some big European nanny state!!!!

Oh, wait a minute on all that. I believe there is a hyphen in your name on this card but not that one. Even though every other piece of information matches identically, that hyphen is critical. So, no freedom for you. Freedom and all that stuff is kinda important in this country but not nearly as important as perfectly matching documentation.
You hit the nail on the head. Wrong information on an ID is the number one reason gun sales are rejected.
 

Deere Poke

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Where exactly did anyone in this thread say that you should not have to be a citizen and be able to prove you are a citizen to vote?

See, that is just it. You guys know you have no way to defend the actual wrong voter suppression so you simply keep going back to the same old strawman that you have beat the living shit out of trying to avoid the real issue.
You still haven't shown were voter ID is suppression. Your whole argument is showing ID and proving you are a citizen is suppression.
 

CocoCincinnati

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You need an ID to buy a gun, does that mean those laws are suppressing minority and poor people's right to the 2nd amendment? You can't have it both ways.

Hell I think it's more racist to assume minorities can't get an ID than it is to require everybody to equally produce one to vote. Voter ID is not suppressing the right to vote, it's protecting the right to vote. Period.
 

steross

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You still haven't shown were voter ID is suppression. Your whole argument is showing ID and proving you are a citizen is suppression.
Probably has to do with the fact that I never even said voter ID is suppression.

So, do you think that stopping brown people from voting protects them or harms them? It is obvious from your vehement arguments for it that you are in favor of them not getting to. I'm just wondering what is your rationale.
 

steross

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You need an ID to buy a gun, does that mean those laws are suppressing minority and poor people's right to the 2nd amendment? You can't have it both ways.

Hell I think it's more racist to assume minorities can't get an ID than it is to require everybody to equally produce one to vote. Voter ID is not suppressing the right to vote, it's protecting the right to vote. Period.
Ok. Here is a challenge for you. I want you to look in this thread and find anywhere that anyone said that people should not have to have ID to vote.
 

Bowers2

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CocoCincinnati

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I'm actually all for having to show an ID to vote. But I also like messing with you guys and you absolutely are calling for more government regs.
Conservative does not mean anarchist. Most conservatives believe government is a necessary evil so to speak, BUT one of the important things is to keep it at the state level not federal level, where possible (according to the 10th amendment).

If a state passed a regulation and the feds pass another reg saying the state can't do that.....isn't support for either considered calling for more government regulation? Which is worse?
 

wrenhal

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Hmmmm. I think my name is mis-spelled on the voter roles at least 10 or 20 or 30 times. I want all 10 or 20 or 30 of my votes counted.

There have to be rules. Accurate and valid ID is not too much to ask for a CITIZEN that wants to exercise their most precious and important right.


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I agree. And if your name is incorrect and you can prove who you are your vote as a citizen is still counted. It is not that there should be no correction. It is that the penalty for the error should not be loss of vote.
That's what a provisional ballot is for.

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CocoCincinnati

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Who is it meant for?
I'll admit I just skimmed several pages once the thread was hijacked, but when I see the words "voter suppression" and "ID" repeated multiple times in multiple posts, it just seemed that the same tired old argument was being had again. If not, I apologize. If you support voter ID laws, then we agree. My reply is meant for anybody who might have a problem with voter ID laws, and there are plenty on this forum.
 

steross

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I'll admit I just skimmed several pages once the thread was hijacked, but when I see the words "voter suppression" and "ID" repeated multiple times in multiple posts, it just seemed that the same tired old argument was being had again. If not, I apologize. If you support voter ID laws, then we agree. My reply is meant for anybody who might have a problem with voter ID laws, and there are plenty on this forum.
Yep, I am fine with making people have ID to vote. I'm not fine with finding/creating minor clerical errors and using that as a method to withhold votes. And, to all the people saying that they then get a "provisional ballot" look at what happens to those. Depending on the jurisdiction, it is not a simple process to fix the error.
As @Deere Poke said, we should trust the election officials to fix the obvious such as a missing hyphen. We do not need the secretary of state to prevent those ballots from going through. It is pro-government and anti-citizen. This is the stuff that keeps the powerful in power.
 

llcoolw

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You hit the nail on the head. Wrong information on an ID is the number one reason gun sales are rejected.
Funny you say that. Finally broke down and bought an AR platform last night. They were very adamant about making sure every letter was correct because if it gets kicked back, it blocks you from purchasing or trying to purchase for some period of time. When I voted, they just glanced at last name and address to make sure they matched, I wasn’t given a warning that if I messed it up, I would be blocked from voting for some period of time.
 

Deere Poke

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Funny you say that. Finally broke down and bought an AR platform last night. They were very adamant about making sure every letter was correct because if it gets kicked back, it blocks you from purchasing or trying to purchase for some period of time. When I voted, they just glanced at last name and address to make sure they matched, I wasn’t given a warning that if I messed it up, I would be blocked from voting for some period of time.
If you have recently moved refrain from buying a firearm for a few months or it can be fun buying them for years to come.
 

Deere Poke

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Probably has to do with the fact that I never even said voter ID is suppression.

So, do you think that stopping brown people from voting protects them or harms them? It is obvious from your vehement arguments for it that you are in favor of them not getting to. I'm just wondering what is your rationale.
You started out saying requiring ID was suppression because a clerical error could prevent someone from voting. I agree that shouldn't happen common sense of election workers should be able to get past that. Typo's are also a completely random form of suppression (therefore not suppression) especially on last names. Every ethnicity has some crazy last names that are prone to typos. People almost always spell my last name wrong and it's 5 letters.

Like I said look into ballot harvesting if you want to see a real problem that needs to be fixed.