Taxes

  • You are viewing Orangepower as a Guest. To start new threads, reply to posts, or participate in polls or contests - you must register. Registration is free and easy. Click Here to register.

Jonkr06

Territorial Marshal
Aug 18, 2007
7,380
2,974
1,743
Katy, TX
agreed... but Townie keeps throwing his dirty underwear at us anyway.... his constant baiting of the board is absolutely ridiculous, unnecessarily adversarial and intentionally vulcanizing.
For the thousandth time...THAT DOES NOT MEAN HE PAID MORE IN TAXES! There is absolutely no way to know without seeing their return. Anyone who references the size of their return as a gauge to whether or not they paid more does not know what they are talking about. Show me someone who says their effective rate went up and I'll believe them.
 

CaliforniaCowboy

Federal Marshal
Oct 15, 2003
15,564
2,438
1,743
So Cal
so... nobody's got nothing?

I saw some post about 2015, but I don't think the tax cut was retroactive.... and somebody changed my statement from "rich" to "upper class", and linked to earnings.

I don't really know the answer, just asking if someone could actually show that the rich got a better tax break than the middle class (which I think was the allegation)
 
Dec 9, 2013
308
165
593
48
I know, I had just never heard $100K referred to as upper class before. I can see where some people may think it is though.
To me this is what makes tax policy hard to discuss. A family with making >$150k can pay no Fed taxes while a family next door making $150k & same deductions pays at a 24%rate.
 
Last edited:
Dec 9, 2013
308
165
593
48
so... nobody's got nothing?

I saw some post about 2015, but I don't think the tax cut was retroactive.... and somebody changed my statement from "rich" to "upper class", and linked to earnings.

I don't really know the answer, just asking if someone could actually show that the rich got a better tax break than the middle class (which I think was the allegation)
Why? You literally asked for numbers & wanted to know who paid what. And please “Mr I don’t know the difference between Embassy/Consulate/Annex” I think people can substitute wealthy, upper class & rich & we all regardless of which side of the argument catch the meaning.
 
Jul 20, 2018
1,368
191
143
77539
To me this is what makes tax policy hard to discuss. A family with making >$150k can pay no Fed taxes while a family next door making $82k & same deductions pays at a 24% rate.
That's simply not possible for the family making $82000. The MOST a family making $82000 could possibly pay would be 8% or $6579.
 
Oct 30, 2007
3,228
2,867
1,743
There is no true definition of lower, middle, & upper class. Some people consider anything over 2X the average median income to be upper class, but some people classify it as being over $150K in household income. There's definitely a difference between the upper class & the upper 1-2%.

If you look at the new tax brackets, they basically help everyone. But the upper 20% received the biggest tax reduction because they pay the overwhelming majority of our country's taxes.

The only people that seem to be hurting are the ones that had their SALT & mortgage interest deductions lowered. They claim to be middle class, but most of them are probably millionaires.
 
Dec 9, 2013
308
165
593
48
That's simply not possible for the family making $82000. The MOST a family making $82000 could possibly pay would be 8% or $6579.
I apologize for originally posting the $82k & that’s why I changed it. I was thinking about the range when I posted and put the lower end of the 24% range as married filing jointly the bracket is 82501 to 157500.

So my point remains. A family of 4 making 150k can have a rate of 0% while family of 4 making 82501 to 15750 has a rate of 24%. And even in your example a couple making 82k can pay an effective rate 8% & that same family of 4 next door w same standard or itemized deductions can pay 0 on 150k.
 
Last edited:
Jul 20, 2018
1,368
191
143
77539
I apologize for originally posting the $82k & that’s why I changed it. I was thinking about the range when I posted and put the lower end of the 24% range as married filing jointly the bracket is 82501 to 157500.

So my point remains. A family of 4 making 150k can have a rate of 0% while family of 4 making 82501 to 15750 has a rate of 24%. And even in your example a couple making 82k can pay an effective rate 8% & that same family of 4 next door w same standard deductions can pay 0 on 150k.
Of course they could if they could itemize their whole income as deductions. Maybe you know of someone that could do that. I've never seen it. It's most likely that the family making $150k would pay $17683 or an effective rate of 11.8%.
 
Jul 20, 2018
1,368
191
143
77539
I'd also like to know how someone making $150K can pay zero. Asking for a friend.
I do have a friend who owns a LOT of rental property. He's able to use the depreciation deduction on income from his paycheck to almost pay zero income tax. He's putting all of his monthly rent income back into paying off properties and/or buying new. He's also single. Go figure.
 
Dec 9, 2013
308
165
593
48
Of course they could if they could itemize their whole income as deductions. Maybe you know of someone that could do that. I've never seen it. It's most likely that the family making $150k would pay $17683 or an effective rate of 11.8%.
Has nothing to do with deductions or one using standard vs itemized. Family A in Stillwater has income of 150,000 per year claims standard deduction and pays 0 income tax. They are 35yo with 2 kids ages 3 & 5. Neither works but they did inherit from grandpa & invested 100% in municipal bonds form OTA & OA&M (so no state tax either). Family B in Stillwater has income of 150,000 and pays 17,683 in taxes after standard deduction (I have no idea if 17,683 is right I’m just saying that’s what they paid after deductions and everything for purpose of discussion). They too are 35 with 2 kids age 3&5. They work 3 jobs neither are self employed so the have 3 W2s.

This is not a far fetched scenario. It’s not a hypothetical. Happens every day by lots of families. And you can get to Family A tons of ways & not just by inheriting. I wasn’t implying that everyone falls into money. A lot work save and invest. Kudos to either scenario.
 
Last edited:

CaliforniaCowboy

Federal Marshal
Oct 15, 2003
15,564
2,438
1,743
So Cal
Why? You literally asked for numbers & wanted to know who paid what. And please “Mr I don’t know the difference between Embassy/Consulate/Annex” I think people can substitute wealthy, upper class & rich & we all regardless of which side of the argument catch the meaning.
oh my lord.... numbers about the topic, not about taxes under Obama... this should not have to be explained to you.

and no.... you cannot substitute, that was my whole point, nobody can decide on what rich even means but they prattle on and on.

the whole discussion is flat silly and undefined, which is why you cannot provide any numbers on it.... but hey... bash the "rich guy" based on long standing leftist rhetoric.

Frankly I don't even care if the tax reform helped the rich more than the middle class, I simply asked for evidence.... and so far I haven't seen any posted.

moving on.... Ocasio-Castro must have said something disturbing that I need to go check on
 
Dec 9, 2013
308
165
593
48
oh my lord.... numbers about the topic, not about taxes under Obama... this should not have to be explained to you.

and no.... you cannot substitute, that was my whole point, nobody can decide on what rich even means but they prattle on and on.

the whole discussion is flat silly and undefined, which is why you cannot provide any numbers on it.... but hey... bash the "rich guy" based on long standing leftist rhetoric.

Frankly I don't even care if the tax reform helped the rich more than the middle class, I simply asked for evidence.... and so far I haven't seen any posted.

moving on.... Ocasio-Castro must have said something disturbing that I need to go check on
John Miller....Is that you?

And no I fully understand by now Johnny. Regardless if someone has the same ideology as you or not. They cannot possibly ever be correct. But that’s fine. You shout Fail.... Nonsense....Silliness....Alternative facts...won’t change the fact you are wrong from time to time. I never bashed the “rich guy”. You have the slightest clue as to who someone is based on what you think you read. I promise you are way off.

As far as pulling #s from Obama era I figured if anyone could relate it would be you as much whatabout time as you spend talking about Obama, Hillary & others from the past.

You say you don’t care but yet you dog posters time and time again.
 
Last edited:

RxCowboy

Has no Rx for his orange obsession.
A/V Subscriber
Nov 8, 2004
68,713
49,244
1,743
Wishing I was in Stillwater
John Miller....Is that you?

And no I fully understand by now Johnny. Regardless if someone has the same ideology as you or not. They cannot possibly ever be correct. But that’s fine. You shout Fail.... Nonsense....Silliness....Alternative facts...won’t change the fact you are wrong from time to time. I never bashed the “rich guy”. You have the slightest clue as to who someone is based on what you think you read. I promise you are way off.

As far as pulling #s from Obama era I figured if anyone could relate it would be you as much whatabout time as you spend talking about Obama, Hillary & others from the past.

You say you don’t care but yet you dog posters time and time again.
He will double and triple down even when someone is trying to help him.
 

CaliforniaCowboy

Federal Marshal
Oct 15, 2003
15,564
2,438
1,743
So Cal
John Miller....Is that you?

And no I fully understand by now Johnny. Regardless if someone has the same ideology as you or not. They cannot possibly ever be correct. But that’s fine. You shout Fail.... Nonsense....Silliness....Alternative facts...won’t change the fact you are wrong from time to time. I never bashed the “rich guy”. You have the slightest clue as to who someone is based on what you think you read. I promise you are way off.

As far as pulling #s from Obama era I figured if anyone could relate it would be you as much whatabout time as you spend talking about Obama, Hillary & others from the past.

You say you don’t care but yet you dog posters time and time again.
that's, "rich"....

you got nothing, you make excuses for using useless 2015 numbers, and then you claim that I am wrong, because you are right.

LOL... ROTFLMAO

Hollywood couldn't write this stuff
 

CaliforniaCowboy

Federal Marshal
Oct 15, 2003
15,564
2,438
1,743
So Cal
He will double and triple down even when someone is trying to help him.
that's you MO... true to form.... drop the topic and go straight at the other posters... you do it every single time.

you sound like AOC... I'm not trying to rob you, I'm trying to help you, because you have too much money and ...."

I'm better off without help like yours
 

RxCowboy

Has no Rx for his orange obsession.
A/V Subscriber
Nov 8, 2004
68,713
49,244
1,743
Wishing I was in Stillwater
He will double and triple down even when someone is trying to help him.
that's you MO... true to form.... drop the topic and go straight at the other posters... you do it every single time.

you sound like AOC... I'm not trying to rob you, I'm trying to help you, because you have too much money and ...."

I'm better off without help like yours
Indeed.

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk