State of Big 12 Programs over the next 4 seasons

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Apr 18, 2009
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#41
While I'm not a Gundy groupie, we do have a lot coming together over the next couple years...

-Offensive line depth is improving. I know we had a poor Bedlam showing, but overall there was a noticeable improvement in the o-line this season. Recruiting has drastically improved there, and that trend will continue.
-The defense did (and continues) to make strides. We're just entering the third season of Knowles, and that's when things happened at his previous job. We saw the improvement late season. I believe that will continue.
-WR talent (CJ, etc) looks good for the forseeable future.
-Even though unproven, we do have some dudes at RB. Dropoff from Chuba? Yes. But we're not going into the dumpster.
-Spencer was putting it together mid-season. Kid has a strong future with us. Illingsworth is the future after that.

We really do have a lot of positive things happening. We need to quit using OU as the barometer. We just had our most successful decade in the history of the program. We had some pretty devastating injuries this season and STILL managed to string together eight regular season wins.

We lose perspective sometimes, I think.
Agree 100%. We have Dudes, on this board, that question every play call, but are they coaches? No, they are arm chair coaches. I'd bet half of these Dudes could not fit into a present day airline seat, although, as they get smaller I may not either. Just saying. We have had improvements. No one saw CH as a go to guy. Is he gone, probably, it is college ball. Just enjoy these moments. I'm sure someone out there thinks that thought is ...fill in the blank.
 
Aug 16, 2019
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#42
Let’s see how well Baylor dose the next couple of years as the last two recruiting classes from the Art Briles era are gone after this year. Most of their studs this year were from those last two Briles classes as they were a senior laden team.
 

RxCowboy

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Nov 8, 2004
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#43
This.
3a. Nebraska canned Solich (after a 9-3 season) because he wasn't Tom Osborne and have been teh suck ever since. This is what I am afraid of for Pokes.
That is more likely to happen than firing a good coach, hiring another, and reaching the "next level"... because there are far more suck coaches than great ones.
 

RxCowboy

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#44
Agree 100%. We have Dudes, on this board, that question every play call, but are they coaches? No, they are arm chair coaches.
If you really want to find out how little you know about football, go get a group of 9 and 10 year olds and teach them how to block and run an offense. It ain't xbox.
 
Oct 7, 2012
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#45
1. Money, second only to Texas in the conference
2. Texas fired a good coach in hopes of getting a great one, and it doesn't always work out that way (Gundy haters please take notice)
3. Nebraska fled the conference in hopes of finding more success in another conference, and it doesn't always work out that way
I respectfully disagree that Nebraska fled the conference in hopes of finding more success. I think they left because UT and the Longhorn network had way to much influence on the conference.
 

RxCowboy

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#46
I respectfully disagree that Nebraska fled the conference in hopes of finding more success. I think they left because UT and the Longhorn network had way to much influence on the conference.
Uh-huh. Do you think it would've looked different to them if they had been 4-2 instead of 2-4, and oh-for in the last 3, in the Big 12 CCG?

Has the LHN actually given Texas any advantages in football?

1576073804330.png
 

Jostate

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Jun 24, 2005
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#48
Has the LHN actually given Texas any advantages in football?

View attachment 75678
It's hard to see how having your own network, and the millions that come with it, couldn't be an advantage. Yet somehow UT continues to defy all that I would believe to be logical about college football and turn gold into gopher poop and negate that advantage. Of course at the time they first got that network deal it appeared it would be a big difference maker.

It still angers me every time I look at my channel lineup and see:

Big10
SEC
SEC2
Pac12
LHN
 
May 4, 2011
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Charleston, SC
#50
Uh-huh. Do you think it would've looked different to them if they had been 4-2 instead of 2-4, and oh-for in the last 3, in the Big 12 CCG?

Has the LHN actually given Texas any advantages in football?

View attachment 75678
It all comes down to money and (according to some out here) having a good faith partner. The LHN was and is an impediment to developing a conference network like all of the other power 5 conferences. Then and now, the conference networks generated a lot of revenue. Texas was not willing to negotiate on any of that and frankly, it makes me glad the LHN and their football program overall are terrible because they've helped kneecap the Big 12.

Also, keep in mind Nebraska was not alone. We lost a third of the conference. I'm sure some people at each of those schools thought they might be more successful, but that would have been thinking long term and would never have been the only reason. In some ways they're right, too. Would anyone argue right now that the path to the playoff is easier winning the Big 12 than the B1G or SEC?

As a final point, all of those schools went to conferences with more football national titles than the one they were leaving. The B1G was down at the time, but who really thought they would stay down? It would be idiotic to expect more success in conferences like that without improving your program.
 

Rack

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Oct 13, 2004
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#51
It's so cute how confident our fans are about future seasons. Can you just change your name to "NEXT Year" already?

Also, what do you mean by "serious contender"? Like, we might lose to uo by less than 10 instead of three scores, or do you mean we'll seriously contend with Baylor, Texas, and Iowa State for 2nd or 3rd in the Big 12?
If you focus on failure you are destined to repeat it. If you focus on success the same applies...Optimism breeds optimism and negativity also reproduces.
 

wrenhal

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Aug 11, 2011
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#52
I respectfully disagree that Nebraska fled the conference in hopes of finding more success. I think they left because UT and the Longhorn network had way to much influence on the conference.
Uh-huh. Do you think it would've looked different to them if they had been 4-2 instead of 2-4, and oh-for in the last 3, in the Big 12 CCG?

Has the LHN actually given Texas any advantages in football?

View attachment 75678
You have to go from the perspective they had. They didn't know Texas would start to suck. They saw it as a major recruiting advantage for Texas having ESPN do their own network rather than a conference one.

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May 4, 2011
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#53
You have to go from the perspective they had. They didn't know Texas would start to suck. They saw it as a major recruiting advantage for Texas having ESPN do their own network rather than a conference one.

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If you're talking ESPN as "they" that makes sense, but Texas moved forward with that and gave the middle finger to any concerns about the long term health of the conference. Of course they thought it would be better for them, but they also saw basically every other conference moving toward a conference network and basically said "Pass. We don't have to negotiate with anyone else in our conference and if they leave, we don't care." They can toil in football suckitude for as long as they have that stupid LHN.
 

Rack

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Oct 13, 2004
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#54
Well you got one of four correct. We are young. Everything else about the program is trending down and has been for 3-4 years. I expect our days in the top 4 are over for the most part if a couple of these new hires work out.
We have:

* More wins that last year
* A younger roster than last year
* A QB that will return from this year
* An OC in his second year next year not his first
* A OL coach in his second year next year not his first
* An improving O-line
* Finished in the top 3 of the conference THIS year
* A team that was 4-1 to end the year after winning two road games (one in which they were an underdog)
* A fanbase that is not happy with just making a bowl anymore and one that wants to win championships
* We don't know what our two best players are doing regarding the draft yet

So (besides a few negative vocal fans in our midst) how are we trending down?? Sorry, I honestly don't see it.
 
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Sep 9, 2013
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#55
WVU will win this conference every 4-5 years, just like it did in the old BE. Just needed the right coach--DH isnt good, we have seen that @ Houston which was expected to be a top group of 5 program this year.

Big 12 has good teams, but no better than Miami in its heyday or VT who won like 5 of 7 ACC titles after they left the BE for the ACC. And while Cuse, Pitt, and BC all suck now, they were top 25ish teams back then.

Neil Brown and VK are the real deal. DH left them no cards to play with on offense. Will take time to rebuild that oline, and DH didnt even leave a qb on the roster who could start for Rice. NB is a known guru in recruiting, and WVU will get the players it needs to beat Texas and OU just like they beat Miami and VT when they had better players.
 

wrenhal

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Aug 11, 2011
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#56
You have to go from the perspective they had. They didn't know Texas would start to suck. They saw it as a major recruiting advantage for Texas having ESPN do their own network rather than a conference one.

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If you're talking ESPN as "they" that makes sense, but Texas moved forward with that and gave the middle finger to any concerns about the long term health of the conference. Of course they thought it would be better for them, but they also saw basically every other conference moving toward a conference network and basically said "Pass. We don't have to negotiate with anyone else in our conference and if they leave, we don't care." They can toil in football suckitude for as long as they have that stupid LHN.
No, I'm saying they=Nebraska, et al. LHN was a reason for them leaving.

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May 4, 2011
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#57
No, I'm saying they=Nebraska, et al. LHN was a reason for them leaving.

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Gotcha. Agreed, and you can't ignore the money side of success. Not just viewers. Money=recruiting resources=better chance of success. Same thing applies to coaching hires and facilities, etc.
 

jetman

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Nov 27, 2004
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#58
WVU will win this conference every 4-5 years, just like it did in the old BE. Just needed the right coach--DH isnt good, we have seen that @ Houston which was expected to be a top group of 5 program this year.

Big 12 has good teams, but no better than Miami in its heyday or VT who won like 5 of 7 ACC titles after they left the BE for the ACC. And while Cuse, Pitt, and BC all suck now, they were top 25ish teams back then.

Neil Brown and VK are the real deal. DH left them no cards to play with on offense. Will take time to rebuild that oline, and DH didnt even leave a qb on the roster who could start for Rice. NB is a known guru in recruiting, and WVU will get the players it needs to beat Texas and OU just like they beat Miami and VT when they had better players.
My prediction is this predicton will work out as well as your predictions usually do.
 

Rack

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Oct 13, 2004
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#59
WVU will win this conference every 4-5 years, just like it did in the old BE. Just needed the right coach--DH isnt good, we have seen that @ Houston which was expected to be a top group of 5 program this year.

Big 12 has good teams, but no better than Miami in its heyday or VT who won like 5 of 7 ACC titles after they left the BE for the ACC. And while Cuse, Pitt, and BC all suck now, they were top 25ish teams back then.

Neil Brown and VK are the real deal. DH left them no cards to play with on offense. Will take time to rebuild that oline, and DH didnt even leave a qb on the roster who could start for Rice. NB is a known guru in recruiting, and WVU will get the players it needs to beat Texas and OU just like they beat Miami and VT when they had better players.
By "4-5" you mean 45 right?
 

Rack

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#60
Uh-huh. Do you think it would've looked different to them if they had been 4-2 instead of 2-4, and oh-for in the last 3, in the Big 12 CCG?

Has the LHN actually given Texas any advantages in football?

View attachment 75678
What are these teams current record vs the Big 12 since leaving the conference? I'd assume it's negative based on our record vs them since they left but I don't know.