Sanders Turnovers Limit?

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Feb 24, 2020
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#81
Cool let’s discredit a guy for a play that didn’t happen so it fits your narrative.

I’m just happy to see no turnovers against one of the better defenses we have played.

The fact that you want to come on here and disparage a guy that improved on his biggest weakness says more about you as a person than him as a player...
Sensitive much??? Hopefully you're not this soft in real life. I mean it's not like what i said is wrong lol. Save the holier than thou speech for when the camera's are rolling. It's a message board man...get over yourself
 
Aug 22, 2006
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#82
If QB1 is injured you need to play QB2 and I don't agree that it's all the line...He holds on to the ball too long, doesn't scan the field, doesn't seem to have blind side awareness and forces throws...oh and drops the ball once a game at least. Maybe he improves, but it's definately his problem as much as it is the 0line...See Tulsa...SI saved our butts behind an oline that was patchwork in that game...as soon as he was put it our team changed and life was breathed into the offense. Some guys just have that IT to play the position and inspire others to step up. I think SI has that...SS, I'm just not sure he's quite as good.
I agree SI is our future (as I have stated multiple times). A great pocket QB knows where the outlet is which does relieve pressure on the OLine. However, even Shane was not impervious to being sacked or rushed in the games he played. While we can incorporate shorter passes and spread the field more so with a pocket passer, that only gets us so far. IF an opposing Defense has no respect for our running game they will bring pressure more often. Unfortunately we have to be balanced to an extent which means a reliable O Line.
If the D brings pressure the short passing game gains more yards after the catch, if the d plays off you run the ball. Go watch some of the 2011 season if you want to see what a quick accurate qb does in this offense.

Sent from my SM-G970U using Tapatalk
 

Cimarron

It's not dying I'm talking about, it's living.
Jun 28, 2007
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#83
Cool let’s discredit a guy for a play that didn’t happen so it fits your narrative.

I’m just happy to see no turnovers against one of the better defenses we have played.

The fact that you want to come on here and disparage a guy that improved on his biggest weakness says more about you as a person than him as a player...
KSU was not one of the best defenses we've faced.

In fact Illingworth faced the two toughest defenses so far on our schedule in WVA and Tulsa. In those two games Illingworth had 1 turnover, so did Sanders in 18 plays (fumble).

1604935953496.png
 
Nov 27, 2007
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#84
KSU was not one of the best defenses we've faced.

In fact Illingworth faced the two toughest defenses so far on our schedule in WVA and Tulsa. In those two games Illingworth had 1 turnover, so did Sanders in 18 plays (fumble).

View attachment 86984
Words have meanings. I said “better” not “best.”
KSU’s defense is better than Texas’
KSU’s defense is better than KU’s
KSU’s defense is as good if not better than ISU’s.

Who said anything about SI? I simply stated that SS had zero turnovers against one of the better defenses that we have played...
 
Sep 12, 2013
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#85
Why?

With Sanders at QB, All plays look line a QB design run. Opposing D already sniff, spy and ready for that. Sanders should only run on broken plays. With Sanders reading the Defense, and the patch-up OL group, there are many broken plays will come by.....
Why? Because he's a great runner. He needs to run the ball from a play that has blocking setup for the run. By the time he's running from a busted play he generally doesn't have anywhere to run and the blocking isn't setup correctly.
 
Sep 23, 2010
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#86
I almost lost it when he fumbled the first play of the game with all the ball security talk. He did better in this department but he did almost give one away in the red zone as well. Baby steps.

I like bring Presley in on the jet sweep. We need get some more running around the edge so we can zone read that as well and Sanders can use his speed to get up the middle like we got killed with their qb. Sanders speed downhill is tough to stop if they have to key on Chuba or other backs getting around the edge
 

Cimarron

It's not dying I'm talking about, it's living.
Jun 28, 2007
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#87
Words have meanings. I said “better” not “best.”
KSU’s defense is better than Texas’
KSU’s defense is better than KU’s
KSU’s defense is as good if not better than ISU’s.

Who said anything about SI? I simply stated that SS had zero turnovers against one of the better defenses that we have played...
How do explain so many turnovers against the worst defenses we've faced?

After all, if you are going to have turnovers would you not expect more of them against the best defenses, not the worst defenses?
 
Nov 27, 2007
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#88
How do explain so many turnovers against the worst defenses we've faced?

After all, if you are going to have turnovers would you not expect more of them against the best defenses, not the worst defenses?
Dude...I don’t know what in world you are reading or why you are trying to counter a point that I am not making.

Again! All I said was that he improved on his biggest weakness on one of the better defenses.

I didn’t say that his turnovers are not problematic. I didn’t say anything about any other game or any other player.

Please tell me what the hell you’re talking about?
 

Cimarron

It's not dying I'm talking about, it's living.
Jun 28, 2007
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#89
Dude...I don’t know what in world you are reading or why you are trying to counter a point that I am not making.

Again! All I said was that he improved on his biggest weakness on one of the better defenses.

I didn’t say that his turnovers are not problematic. I didn’t say anything about any other game or any other player.

Please tell me what the hell you’re talking about?
You can go back to this comment you made when all someone did was point out the statistics on Sanders.

The fact that you want to come on here and disparage a guy that improved on his biggest weakness says more about you as a person than him as a player...
One game against a nationally average defense with no turnovers doesn't mean Sanders has turned the corner. And in that game the offense managed to score 13 points. I know a large part of the problem are issues of the offensive line.

But in my opinion, Sanders seemed indecisive on pass plays, looked to run to quick when he had an open receiver, and isn't the most accurate on passes downfield. Too often the passes are short, long, or over the wrong shoulder. I recall one downfield pass against Texas to a wide open receiver at about the 10 yard line over the wrong shoulder that resulted in the receiver going out of bounds at the five instead of an easy TD if he gets the ball over the other shoulder.

He's three years into the system. It's time to have these things cleaned up.
 
Nov 27, 2007
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#90
You can go back to this comment you made when all someone did was point out the statistics on Sanders.



One game against a nationally average defense with no turnovers doesn't mean Sanders has turned the corner. And in that game the offense managed to score 13 points. I know a large part of the problem are issues of the offensive line.

But in my opinion, Sanders seemed indecisive on pass plays, looked to run to quick when he had an open receiver, and isn't the most accurate on passes downfield. Too often the passes are short, long, or over the wrong shoulder. I recall one downfield pass against Texas to a wide open receiver at about the 10 yard line over the wrong shoulder that resulted in the receiver going out of bounds at the five instead of an easy TD if he gets the ball over the other shoulder.

He's three years into the system. It's time to have these things cleaned up.
All I said is that he improved his biggest weakness against one of the better defenses we have played....

KSU is one of the better defenses we played. -Fact.
Zero turnovers is an improvement over or multiple. - Fact
You can’t credit a guy for a turnover that didn’t happen. - Fact

Did I say he turned the corner? Or did I say that all of his issues are fixed? Did I even say anything other than what I posted?

Stop putting context or meaning to my post that isn’t there.
 
Nov 6, 2010
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#91
How do explain so many turnovers against the worst defenses we've faced?

After all, if you are going to have turnovers would you not expect more of them against the best defenses, not the worst defenses?
I think we put the ball on the ground 3 times Saturday and didn't lose any of them. Sometimes it's just about how the ball bounces. Every time we fumbled against Texas they seemed to have a guy right there to get his hands on it. Bad luck for us against Texas, but incredibly good luck against K-State given one of their fumbles landed right in our DB's hands in mid air and off he went for the winning score.
 

Cimarron

It's not dying I'm talking about, it's living.
Jun 28, 2007
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#92
All I said is that he improved his biggest weakness against one of the better defenses we have played....

KSU is one of the better defenses we played. -Fact.
Zero turnovers is an improvement over or multiple. - Fact
You can’t credit a guy for a turnover that didn’t happen. - Fact

Did I say he turned the corner? Or did I say that all of his issues are fixed? Did I even say anything other than what I posted?

Stop putting context or meaning to my post that isn’t there.
If 'better" is statistically average then I concede.

The average points allowed by 123 division 1 teams is 28.76. One standard deviation is 9.42.

KSU allows 25.1 points per game, well within 1 standard deviation of the mean.

Pretty average defense.
 
Nov 6, 2010
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#94
I'll take more of those.
Me and you both brother! And speaking of turnovers, we're overdue for more than we're getting given how good our defense is playing. I guess though if you're constantly making teams punt after 3 plays, your opportunities for TO's go way down. That and our O is not putting pressure on the other team to score every possession to keep up like in years past.
 
Aug 22, 2006
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#95
Me and you both brother! And speaking of turnovers, we're overdue for more than we're getting given how good our defense is playing. I guess though if you're constantly making teams punt after 3 plays, your opportunities for TO's go way down. That and our O is not putting pressure on the other team to score every possession to keep up like in years past.
This is an excellent point, when the offense fails to put pressure on the other team to score it doesn't force the opponent to take risks and doesn't provide the same opportunities to the defense to get turnovers.
 
Nov 27, 2007
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#96
If 'better" is statistically average then I concede.

The average points allowed by 123 division 1 teams is 28.76. One standard deviation is 9.42.

KSU allows 25.1 points per game, well within 1 standard deviation of the mean.

Pretty average defense.
I am not even saying that KSU is a good defense... Simply that KSU one of the better defenses we have played. Their 25.1 PPG is pretty average however it's better than ISU (26.7) Texas (29.7) and Kansas (48.4).

They are better than 3 of the 5 other OSU opponents, no matter how average they are.

There is no context other than they are one of the better teams we have played and that he had fewer turnovers.

Fun fact. Despite getting ZERO turnovers off the pokes KSU trails only UT in teams that we have played in terms of turnovers gained.
 
Nov 6, 2010
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#97
This is an excellent point, when the offense fails to put pressure on the other team to score it doesn't force the opponent to take risks and doesn't provide the same opportunities to the defense to get turnovers.
Yea, and that was never made more abundantly clear than when we punted to the cats with less than 2 minutes left and they had to throw. Instant pic.
 

Cimarron

It's not dying I'm talking about, it's living.
Jun 28, 2007
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#98
I am not even saying that KSU is a good defense... Simply that KSU one of the better defenses we have played. Their 25.1 PPG is pretty average however it's better than ISU (26.7) Texas (29.7) and Kansas (48.4).

They are better than 3 of the 5 other OSU opponents, no matter how average they are.

There is no context other than they are one of the better teams we have played and that he had fewer turnovers.

Fun fact. Despite getting ZERO turnovers off the pokes KSU trails only UT in teams that we have played in terms of turnovers gained.
We should be very concerned that our offense only scored 13 points against a team giving up 25 points a game.....
 
Sep 23, 2010
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#99
Our offense has been a struggle, no doubt. And bottom line, OU is going to score some points. We will have to score with them. Which qb makes fewer mistakes will be a big factor....it's been a huge factor in the losses by both teams. So yes, still real concern with Sanders decision making and ball security.
 
Nov 27, 2007
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We should be very concerned that our offense only scored 13 points against a team giving up 25 points a game.....
True. Even without Wallace and Chuba for a portion, I would have liked to see us fair better. The fist half was hard to watch. We have only outscored the opponents average against WVU and UT.