Official Game Thread: Iowa State vs. Oklahoma State

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Sep 8, 2014
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agreed that Eddie was a great coach for us...but What was his record vs KU again?

Gundy got us a #3 in the country and should have been in the national final...same diff. in a harder (at OSU) sport to do that in with an eltie blue blood in his back yard. just sayin
Done it twice??

I would say New Years 6 bowls would be comparable to say a sweet 16..happen much?

Talent and money..who has had more? Gundy or Eddie? Who took decent players and made them stars? Who improved more under their coaches tutalege...Johnny Pittman and Bryant Reeves or Lunt and Rudolph?

Sure Mason is in the NFL but did he really develop at OSU the way say Reeves did?

Gundy is the best football coach record wise we have ever had but he had Boone’s resources to back him up...no NFL talent quarterback...what happens? Yesterday

Sutton..no NBA players? Probably second round of the tournament.
 
Sep 8, 2014
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Done it twice??

I would say New Years 6 bowls would be comparable to say a sweet 16..happen much?

Talent and money..who has had more? Gundy or Eddie? Who took decent players and made them stars? Who improved more under their coaches tutalege...Johnny Pittman and Bryant Reeves or Lunt and Rudolph?

Sure Mason is in the NFL but did he really develop at OSU the way say Reeves did?

Gundy is the best football coach record wise we have ever had but he had Boone’s resources to back him up...no NFL talent quarterback...what happens? Yesterday

Sutton..no NBA players? Probably second round of the tournament.
But I know...Travis Ford was an outstanding coach..better than Eddie...and a heck of a man..just never got his players in the system and ‘Didn’t fit OSU’....I have been told that plenty of times over the years on this board

I don’t want Gundy’s head...I do wish he would get it screwed on straight though when it comes to coordinators....
 
Sep 8, 2014
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But I know...Travis Ford was an outstanding coach..better than Eddie...and a heck of a man..just never got his players in the system and ‘Didn’t fit OSU’....I have been told that plenty of times over the years on this board

I don’t want Gundy’s head...I do wish he would get it screwed on straight though when it comes to coordinators....
Don’t mind me...I’m just bitter....
 

Rack

Federal Marshal
Oct 13, 2004
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Done it twice??

I would say New Years 6 bowls would be comparable to say a sweet 16..happen much?

Talent and money..who has had more? Gundy or Eddie? Who took decent players and made them stars? Who improved more under their coaches tutalege...Johnny Pittman and Bryant Reeves or Lunt and Rudolph?

Sure Mason is in the NFL but did he really develop at OSU the way say Reeves did?

Gundy is the best football coach record wise we have ever had but he had Boone’s resources to back him up...no NFL talent quarterback...what happens? Yesterday

Sutton..no NBA players? Probably second round of the tournament.
It's pointless to argue about who was/is better..both were great for Oklahoma State

my point is best illustrated in this fact...
How did we do post Eddie Sutton in basketball? Even with Boone's money and new locker rooms and bling?
 
Sep 8, 2014
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It's pointless to argue about who was/is better..both were great for Oklahoma State

my point is best illustrated in this fact...
How did we do post Eddie Sutton in basketball? Even with Boone's money and new locker rooms and bling?
I agree. My opinion Eddies greatest failure (in coaching) was pushing Sean as his successor. I’ve always heard Self wanted the job but with Sean on the bench it was clear that wasn’t going to happen....Kansas says thanks...

Gundy is a great face for the program..a more sane version of Mike Leach in the national media’s eyes...I’m a man rant..mullet, snakes, wrestling outfit, dancing...media eats that stuff up and it keeps us in everyone’s mind whether we win or not...folks know OSU because we have a quirky coach, win a few games and have boones money...

I just think it sometimes goes to his head. I think he is a great manager and marketer but he is (unlike Eddie) NOT an elite coach in his sport..he is a very good coach and an elite marketer/manager..that’s why he need very good coordinators..which I don’t think we have now...and Gundy (I think) sees no reason to change that because (I think) the attention we get (because of him) and our success (him plus talent..which he helped get and in the case of 2011 a very good oc) has gone to his head and he forgot it was Holgy and Monkum who made the offense what it was.

That’s what I think
 

Rack

Federal Marshal
Oct 13, 2004
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I agree. My opinion Eddies greatest failure (in coaching) was pushing Sean as his successor. I’ve always heard Self wanted the job but with Sean on the bench it was clear that wasn’t going to happen....Kansas says thanks...

Gundy is a great face for the program..a more sane version of Mike Leach in the national media’s eyes...I’m a man rant..mullet, snakes, wrestling outfit, dancing...media eats that stuff up and it keeps us in everyone’s mind whether we win or not...folks know OSU because we have a quirky coach, win a few games and have boones money...

I just think it sometimes goes to his head. I think he is a great manager and marketer but he is (unlike Eddie) NOT an elite coach in his sport..he is a very good coach and an elite marketer/manager..that’s why he need very good coordinators..which I don’t think we have now...and Gundy (I think) sees no reason to change that because (I think) the attention we get (because of him) and our success (him plus talent..which he helped get and in the case of 2011 a very good oc) has gone to his head and he forgot it was Holgy and Monkum who made the offense what it was.

That’s what I think
I agree with the vast majority of that...Gundy is the best thing for our program...but he isn't an elite "in game coach" just like Miles wasn't either...especially in clock management. My point is that we need to work with what we have, not run him off. Certainly we need better coaching in special teams, oline and defense, but it's our DC's first year...we still have an semi-elite offense just need a better defense to go with it.
 
Apr 14, 2018
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I agree with the vast majority of that...Gundy is the best thing for our program...but he isn't an elite "in game coach" just like Miles wasn't either...especially in clock management. My point is that we need to work with what we have, not run him off. Certainly we need better coaching in special teams, oline and defense, but it's our DC's first year...we still have an semi-elite offense just need a better defense to go with it.
I actually liked the offense that Fedora and Gundy were running. That Missouri game in 2008 was clutch. I prefer that over the offense we've got now. Lining up under center is better for the running game. And the TE was actually involved back then. Wish we would integrate some of the air raid and I formation into the playbook...a multi type offense. More running plays...successful running plays...from under center would help out the defense by keeping them off the field longer.
Of course, that would be more than 6 plays and it would take new QBs like 3 years to learn the playbook. /sarcasm
 
Sep 23, 2018
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You have two very distinct groups of OSU fans right now: those who knew about OSU football prior to about 2001 and those who didn't. They yhave VERY different expectations based on their experience since watching OSU.

The older fanbase seems perfectly content with losing to OU every year and making a bowl. The younger group isn't cool with that and wants more.

I'm decidedly in the latter group.
Over on Robert Allen's ball-sloshing blog, they are most definitely in the latter part. "Well, if you knew how OSU was before Gundy took over, you'd be singing a different tune." Ah, awesome, so I should just settle for where we're at and never push for my team to be even better, got it.
 
Sep 23, 2018
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Yep, I'm an old guy and I do love your optimism, but I guess I've been around so long I do sort of start to see it as folly. I don't think we can get there until we grow our fanbase and we can't grow our fanbase with some people until we get there...so it's sort of a catch 22. I love that you want us to win so badly that you think that a head coaching change is what needs to happen in order for us to do it, the problem is that I don't see that as being a solution but actually more of an impediment to exactly what we all want.
I'm going to write a novel, so to everyone, please forgive me.

First of all, let me preface this by saying that I appreciate your even-keeled approach and thoughtfulness in your responses, it's most appreciated. And I apologize if I have come across as too much of a "bulldog", per se. You are correct, I am very optimistic and want the absolute best for my team/school, and think it's attainable with the right mindset, people, system, etc. And as Birry pointed out, I do definitely think there is a bit of a generational clash that really highlights how the program is viewed, *who* thinks *what* can be achieved, that kind of thing.

Second, here's my thing: I grew up a fan of OU. I wanted to go and be a meteorologist. Things changed at Jenks, where I went for high school (and elementary and middle also). I wanted to be an automotive engineer, and thought OSU would be better for that. Things didn't go as planned, as I quickly found out I was an idiot who couldn't handle all of the physics and calculus and differential equations stuff necessary for that degree, so I switched to something easier. Nevertheless, during this time, I really grew into being a full-blown OSU fan. I was *proud* to get one of the Nike Orange Bball jerseys with Tony Allen's number 24 on it, wore that thing ALL THE TIME, especially on the night we beat St. Joe's to get to the Final Four. I was living on campus in one of the new suites (Patchin Hall). My friends and I immediately went to Murphy's and did some shots, had some beers, it was pretty wild. All in all, I eventually grew to *love* Stillwater, loved being on campus, had a fun experience despite some of my academic mishaps in the initial stages.

Because of this, I also took great issue, among other matters, with this pathetic notion that "nobody wants to come play in Stillwater, it's out in the middle of nowhere". This is complete BS. Anyone want to know how many schools are "out in the middle of nowhere", that are really goddamn good historically? Clemson, Georgia, Florida, Virginia Tech, some fellow Big 12 teams. Remember when K-State was a perennial North division winner, when Bill Snyder actually pulled in great recruits? It is such a pathetic belief. Why do people want to go play in bumf*** Tuscaloosa, Alabama of all places? Baton Rouge, Louisiana, home of mosquitoes that will cut you up into little pieces and eat you? Can't we say the same thing for those places, as others do about Stillwater? And Boone Pickens only helped by making our athletic facilities top-notch (which they really are, that is not a joke).

I want those naysayers proven wrong. I want the SEC chuds, who think their conference can never do wrong, to be put in their place for once. And I want us to do it.
 

Rack

Federal Marshal
Oct 13, 2004
18,390
8,297
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I'm going to write a novel, so to everyone, please forgive me.

First of all, let me preface this by saying that I appreciate your even-keeled approach and thoughtfulness in your responses, it's most appreciated. And I apologize if I have come across as too much of a "bulldog", per se. You are correct, I am very optimistic and want the absolute best for my team/school, and think it's attainable with the right mindset, people, system, etc. And as Birry pointed out, I do definitely think there is a bit of a generational clash that really highlights how the program is viewed, *who* thinks *what* can be achieved, that kind of thing.

Second, here's my thing: I grew up a fan of OU. I wanted to go and be a meteorologist. Things changed at Jenks, where I went for high school (and elementary and middle also). I wanted to be an automotive engineer, and thought OSU would be better for that. Things didn't go as planned, as I quickly found out I was an idiot who couldn't handle all of the physics and calculus and differential equations stuff necessary for that degree, so I switched to something easier. Nevertheless, during this time, I really grew into being a full-blown OSU fan. I was *proud* to get one of the Nike Orange Bball jerseys with Tony Allen's number 24 on it, wore that thing ALL THE TIME, especially on the night we beat St. Joe's to get to the Final Four. I was living on campus in one of the new suites (Patchin Hall). My friends and I immediately went to Murphy's and did some shots, had some beers, it was pretty wild. All in all, I eventually grew to *love* Stillwater, loved being on campus, had a fun experience despite some of my academic mishaps in the initial stages.

Because of this, I also took great issue, among other matters, with this pathetic notion that "nobody wants to come play in Stillwater, it's out in the middle of nowhere". This is complete BS. Anyone want to know how many schools are "out in the middle of nowhere", that are really goddamn good historically? Clemson, Georgia, Florida, Virginia Tech, some fellow Big 12 teams. Remember when K-State was a perennial North division winner, when Bill Snyder actually pulled in great recruits? It is such a pathetic belief. Why do people want to go play in bumf*** Tuscaloosa, Alabama of all places? Baton Rouge, Louisiana, home of mosquitoes that will cut you up into little pieces and eat you? Can't we say the same thing for those places, as others do about Stillwater? And Boone Pickens only helped by making our athletic facilities top-notch (which they really are, that is not a joke).

I want those naysayers proven wrong. I want the SEC chuds, who think their conference can never do wrong, to be put in their place for once. And I want us to do it.
Good post.

I agree with most all of that, just don't think the way to get to the promised land is to fire the guy who had us the closest we have ever been too it. Of course Moses did have to die prior to the Israelites being allowed in, so there's that. ;) No, seriously, I think it's to bolster our recruiting in fair ways and to build a culture of winning and treating our players right. The one remaining area that I think has always been a determent to us is the size of our game day fan base, that's why I thought it would be important to build an upper deck on our stadium about six years ago but was blasted on this very board for being absurdly optimistic. I think it's hard to sell a kid on game day in Stillwater when you can go to those other places you mentioned, sans Manhattan (which I see as an inferior program to Oklahoma State), and see 84K plus people in the stands and they don't leave at halftime or the fourth quarter in huge games. I believe that when our fans walk out on the coaches and team, right when the team needs them the most is something that is not only ugly but detrimental in that it drives away recruits. So the guys that think it was a big positive deal to boycott basketball should now know that it, coupled with the end of Eddies career, has only produced the total destruction of our basketball program, not the enhancement of it.

So, while I do think Stillwater has it's issues compared so some of the places you mentioned, I also see that it has become so much more than it used to be over the past decade as is far less of a determent in this day and age of instant communication...we aren't fighting Stillwater nearly as much anymore, we are fighting our own fan base and it's fickle nature due to the fact that it is hard to be a long term fan of a non-blue blood program. This is also why I see coaching changes as detrimental rather than productive as I don't want to go back to where we were before.

Once again, we aren't in disagreement about what we ALL want for our program, just in some of the ways to accomplish that. I think we as fans need to step up, not step back, I think we need to be so devoted that we won't even think about leaving a game no matter the score...that, IMHO, will build championships in a place like Stillwater and is really the only thing, we, on this board have control over. We can have a negative mindset or a positive one. That and the money we donate is the only thing under our control. I choose to see what Gundy has done in the past and realize that he may likely still salvage a bowl season out of this year...I don't know how, but I think that will happen. I know that's not going to satisfy the new bread of fan, but we did lose some key pieces.

Btw, I'm sorry that you grew up an OU fan...lol. I was born and raised on OSU fandom by OSU parents who attended the University in the 1950's...I pledged a frat and spent nearly as much time thrown in theta pond as studying. I also ended up majoring in something easy in order to finish and met my wife of over 30 years on "Dance Hour," btw, she's a Jenks Alum and we live in Jenks School district although my kids went to Christian private school at least post 9th grade. Thanks for your personalizing that post, it gives us an idea of who we are talking with and I respect that. Be careful though not to reveal who your siblings might be...inside joke. :)

Have an awesome week! Go Pokes!
 
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Jul 25, 2018
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I actually liked the offense that Fedora and Gundy were running. That Missouri game in 2008 was clutch. I prefer that over the offense we've got now. Lining up under center is better for the running game. And the TE was actually involved back then. Wish we would integrate some of the air raid and I formation into the playbook...a multi type offense. More running plays...successful running plays...from under center would help out the defense by keeping them off the field longer.
Of course, that would be more than 6 plays and it would take new QBs like 3 years to learn the playbook. /sarcasm
Fedora was gone in '08 & we had the sham of Gunter Brewer/Trooper Taylor as Co-OC's that year, though Gundy ran the show offensively.
 
Feb 27, 2018
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www.tulsaworld.com
From Mark Cooper...

By the time Oklahoma State runs on the field for its homecoming game against Texas on Oct. 27, it will have been 335 days since its last home win over a Big 12 opponent.

The bad news for a Cowboys team that is just 2-5 in its past seven conference home games: It will likely be underdogs in its final two this season against No. 9 Texas and No. 6 West Virginia.

It means there are no gimmes for OSU the rest of the season. It means that, without an upset, OSU could lose four home games for the first time since 2001.

It also means Oklahoma State better regroup quickly before traveling to Kansas State Saturday — a game that suddenly feels like a must-win.