Nike vs In-n-Out: The Silent Majority Have Spoken

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Aug 16, 2012
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#62
I’ll look for it. That changes nothing about what I posted. I was fortunate enough to be able, through back door channels (public cannot purchase LS), to purchase equity in the company many years ago as a result and because we were doing a good deal of it work for them I was privy to research materials. When our contract ended in 05 I got out so it did ok but at that time they had a 10% share I’ve followed it for some time mainly through looking at competitive information. Last I looked they still had the number 1 market share but they were down to under 5%. They have lost the teen and ya market, this looks, to me, like an attempt to try and regain some of that, it’s a reasonable pr move on their part and that’s really all it is, it won’t materially change anything. I used to know some folks there but they’re gone, so that is conjecture on my part but I don’t think it’s too far off.
Nah, not implying I disagreed with anything you posted. Just providing some insight to the different circumstances LS has vs. some of the others in regard to retaining its market position. Despite my disdain for Nike, I will admit many of their products are top quality that should be able to weather a PR storm. Jeans are a dime a dozen anymore and the LS brand does not carry near the clout it once had. In a month, a year, a dozen years, Nike will probably still be one of the big dogs in the athletic apparel/shoe market, regardless of this move.
 

Jonkr06

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Aug 18, 2007
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#63
Jeans are a dime a dozen? I have a very difficult time finding jeans that fit, don't cost a small fortune, and just look like normal jeans. I have no doubt Levis have declined in quality over the years. Pretty much everything has in the endless pursuit of profits through cost cutting. I just haven't found an acceptable alternative.
 

Cimarron

It's not dying I'm talking about, it's living.
Jun 28, 2007
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#64
Add Levi Strauss to the list:

https://bearingarms.com/tom-k/2018/09/05/levi-strauss-joins-anti-gun-nonsense/


Levi Strauss has historically been one of those brands that like to evoke the cowboy image. They love for people to think its jeans are as tough as the people who wear them, that sort of crap.
However, cowboys were more than just tough. They were armed.
That’s part of the image that Levi Strauss has opted to leave behind, and that’s fine. Why alienate part of your customer base by embracing something that will push them away?
Except, that’s not the problem. It’s apparently quite content to follow the lead of companies like Dick’s.
Levi Strauss announced on Tuesday it would be creating a new gun-control group with billionaire Michael Bloomberg and donating millions of dollars to a collection of established gun-control groups.​
The clothing company said it would be partnering with Everytown for Gun Safety and Michael Bloomberg to form Everytown Business Leaders for Gun Safety in a blogpost on their website. It also said it would set up the Safer Tomorrow Fund, which Levi Strauss said would direct more than $1 million over the next four years to “fuel the work of nonprofits and youth activists who are working to end gun violence in America.” The company went on to say it would begin doubling the amount it matches for employee donations to gun-control groups aligned with the fund and pushed employees to use their five hours a month in paid volunteer time at the gun-control groups.​
Levi Strauss said while they had already requested customers not carry firearms in their store in 2016 and had supported gun-control initiatives in the past, they felt they needed to become more politically involved in the issue.​

And just like that, I’ll never own another stitch of Levi Strauss clothing again in my life.
I went to http://levistrauss.com, where’s the cowboy?
 

bleedinorange

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Jan 11, 2010
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#66

Sherry Potter
September 4 at 11:05 PM
Dear Nike,

I want to have a conversation about this hat. It's over 13 years old. I don't remember when I bought it exactly, I don't remember where I bought it. But what I do remember is why I wore it.

On August 10, 2005, I was a newlywed with two young sons. My husband Tim and I had toasted our one month anniversary the night before, and I was enjoying a rare evening to myself, catching up on reading and relishing the quiet. Until there was a knock on my door. I had no way of knowing that the small act of turning a knob was about to shatter my life into a million pieces. I sat numb and in sheer disbelief as I was told that my husband, while in a foot pursuit and subsequent struggle with a suspect that ended up in the road, had been struck and killed by an oncoming vehicle. He took his last breath lying in the middle of the street. What I lost in that moment is indescribable. I had to watch his mother be dealt the most agonizing blow a parent can face, and I couldn't comfort her because I was in my own hell. I had to find a way to gut my own children in the gentlest way possible, and tell them that this man they had come to love, who they looked up to, who cared for them as his own, would never walk through our door again.

I don't know if you've ever attended a police funeral, but watching grown men who've seen the absolute worst things a civilian can imagine, break down and sob over the casket of their brother is an image that never leaves you. The bagpipes haunt my dreams to this day, but it was the faces of my children, the innocence that abandoned them at such a tender age that brought me to my knees.

I had no choice but to move on. We trudged zombie-like through our days for weeks and weeks on end. I never left the house except to drive the boys to school, or buy food we barely touched. I realized that I had to do something. I had to move my body or I was going to crawl out of my own skin. So I put on the only cap I had and I went for a run. It was short, it hurt and it was ugly. But I felt, just for those few moments on that road, like a normal person. So I kept doing it. I put that hat on and I ran every day. Sometimes I had to stop and sit down because I was sobbing so hard. Sometimes I was so angry I ran until I thought I my heart would stop, sometimes I would just scream over and over again, but it still felt better than doing nothing.

That black cap became a symbol to me, it is sweat stained and it's shape is gone, the buckle in the back barely closes; but that hat represents my family's rise from the ashes. It stands for the strength and the sacrifice we made loving a man who had a job that we all knew could end his life, every time he walked out that door. And it did. And I accept that.

I still wear this hat, I wore it on my run this morning.
And then I heard about your new ad campaign.

Colin Kapernick has the absolute right to protest anything he damn well pleases. I don't dispute that for one second. My father, my husband and many, many friends have all served this country and were willing to fight for his right to kneel.

But that right goes both ways. I also have a right to express my disgust at your decision to portray him as some kind of hero. What, exactly has Colin Kapernick sacrificed? His multi million dollar paycheck...? Nope, you already gave him one of those. His reputation? No, he's been fawned over by celebrities and media alike. Funny, Tim Tebow was never called courageous when he knelt.
This man, whose contempt for law enforcement fits him like a...sock, has promoted an agenda that has been proven false time and time again, in study after study. But facts don't seem to matter anymore. This man has thrown his support behind divisive anti-police groups, and donated money directly to a fugitive from justice who escaped prison after killing a police officer. I question the judgement of anyone who would put someone this controversial and divisive at the head of an advertising campaign, but it isn't my company to run.

I don't know if I'll have he heart to ever get rid of this cap, but I will tell you this, I'll never purchase another Nike product as long as I live. You got this one wrong Nike, terribly, terribly wrong.

Sherry Graham-Potter, surviving spouse of Deputy Tim Graham
 

kaboy42

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May 2, 2007
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#67
From Facebook:
Taya Kyle - American Wife

Yesterday at 1:51 PM ·
Nike, I love your gear, but you exhaust my spirit on this one. Your new ad with Colin Kapernick, I get the message, but that sacrificing everything thing…. It just doesn’t play out here. Sacrificing what exactly? A career? I’ve done that both times I chose to stay home and be with my kids instead of continuing my business climb… and it wasn’t sacrificing everything. It was sacrificing one career and some money and it was because of what I believe in and more importantly, who I believe in.

At best, that is all Colin sacrificed… some money and it’s debatable if he really lost his career over it. Maybe he sacrificed the respect of some people while he gained the respect of others. Or maybe he used one career to springboard himself into a different career when the first was waning. I don’t know. What I do know is, he gained popularity and magazine covers he likely wouldn’t have gotten without getting on his knees or as you say, “believing in something.” I’m also thinking the irony is that while I am not privy to the numbers, it’s likely he gained a lucrative Nike contract. So yeah… that whole “sacrificing everything” is insulting to those who really have sacrificed everything.

You want to talk about someone in the NFL sacrificing everything? Pat Tillman. NFL STARTING, not benched, player who left to join the Army and died for it. THAT is sacrificing everything for something you believe in.

How about other warriors? Warriors who will not be on magazine covers, who will not get lucrative contracts and millions of followers from their actions and who have truly sacrificed everything. They did it because they believed in something. Take it from me, when I say they sacrificed everything, they also sacrificed the lives of their loved ones who will never be the same. THAT is sacrificing everything for something they believe in.

Did you get us talking? Yeah, you did. But, your brand recognition was strong enough. Did you teach the next generation of consumers about true grit? Not that I can see.

Taking a stand, or rather a knee, against the flag which has covered the caskets of so many who actually did sacrifice everything for something they believe in, that we all believe in? Well, the irony of your ad..it almost leaves me speechless. Were you trying to be insulting?

Maybe you are banking on the fact we won’t take the time to see your lack of judgement in using words that just don’t fit. Maybe you are also banking on us not seeing Nike as kneeling before the flag. Or maybe you want us to see you exactly that way. I don’t know. All I know is, I was actually in the market for some new kicks and at least for now, I’ve never been more grateful for Under Armour.
I’ve volunteered at multiple Chris Kyle Memorial Benefit / American Valor Foundation events now. The Kyle family knows and lives sacrifice. I've stood there and watched as Chris' father, his mother, his brother Jeff, and his late wife Taya went down a line of wounded veterans AND active military members, hugging them, crying with them, listening to them, trading challenge coins with them, supporting them.

For some odd reason, I have zero recollection of ever seeing even a single image of Colin Kapernick actually "sacrificing" anything.

Ever. :mad:
 
May 31, 2007
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#68
Kaepernick is a fraud. He originally did what he did to save his job, not risk it. Then when it became apparent that his stance might be hindering his chances all of a sudden reports came out that he would now stand if somebody signed him. I see no courage in any of that.

As far as “old white people” go. I’d bet they are one of if not Nike’s #1 customer given how much Nike stuff is bought by not only middle aged adults for themselves but for their children. It seems odd to me that after all this hurt the NFL’s ratings that the strategy is to double down.
 

RxCowboy

Has no Rx for his orange obsession.
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#69
From the Fraternal Order of Police:

BELIEVE IN SOMETHING EVEN IF IT MEANS SACRIFICING EVERYTHING
FOP RESPONDS TO NIKE’S NEW AD CAMPAIGN

Chuck Canterbury, National President of the Fraternal Order of Police, released the following statement:

“Colin Kaepernick and all Americans have the constitutional right to freely express their views, even if they are uninformed and inflammatory. Indeed, law enforcement officers have an obligation to defend these rights and we do so every day, even in those cases when the views expressed are hostile, hateful or offensive to the men and women of law enforcement.

“The Fraternal Order of Police has been called upon to boycott Nike for capitalizing on this former professional football player because he attracts controversy. In our experience, boycotts and similar exercises do not succeed and often serve only to enrich the company—which is not what we want to do. Our members and, for that matter, any American citizen, understands when the law enforcement profession is being insulted— we have no doubt they will make their purchases with that insult in mind.

“If Nike chooses to create an ad campaign featuring a former quarterback who describes cops as ‘pigs’ and makes large donations to the family of a convicted cop killer and wanted fugitive, Joanne Chesimard, who murdered New Jersey State Trooper Werner Foerster in cold blood in 1973, they are free to do so.

“Since 2016, 381 officers have been killed in the line of duty. They believed in something and sacrificed everything, as did the families they left behind. All of the men and women in law enforcement believe in something and are prepared to sacrifice everything.

“Ultimately, this ad campaign will end and our nation will no longer associate ‘sacrifice’ and ‘sneakers.’ Instead, we will once again associate ‘sacrifice’ with our fellow Americans in our military and police departments who stand in harm’s way to protect the rest of us and our right to express ourselves.”
 
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Cimarron

It's not dying I'm talking about, it's living.
Jun 28, 2007
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#70
From the Fraternal Order of Police:

BELIEVE IN SOMETHING EVEN IF IT MEANS SACRIFICING EVERYTHING
FOP RESPONDS TO NIKE’S NEW AD CAMPAIGN

Chuck Canterbury, National President of the Fraternal Order of Police, released the following statement:

“Colin Kaepernick and all Americans have the constitutional right to freely express their views, even if they are uninformed and inflammatory. Indeed, law enforcement officers have an obligation to defend these rights and we do so every day, even in those cases when the views expressed are hostile, hateful or offensive to the men and women of law enforcement.

“The Fraternal Order of Police has been called upon to boycott Nike for capitalizing on this former professional football player because he attracts controversy. In our experience, boycotts and similar exercises do not succeed and often serve only to enrich the company—which is not what we want to do. Our members and, for that matter, any American citizen, understands when the law enforcement profession is being insulted— we have no doubt they will make their purchases with that insult in mind.

“If Nike chooses to create an ad campaign featuring a former quarterback who describes cops as ‘pigs’ and makes large donations to the family of a convicted cop killer and wanted fugitive, Joanne Chesimard, who murdered New Jersey State Trooper Werner Foerster in cold blood in 1973, they are free to do so.

“Since 2016, 381 officers have been killed in the line of duty. They believed in something and sacrificed everything, as did the families they left behind. All of the men and women in law enforcement believe in something and are prepared to sacrifice everything.

“Ultimately, this ad campaign will end and our nation will no longer associate ‘sacrifice’ and ‘sneakers.’ Instead, we will once again associate ‘sacrifice’ with our fellow Americans in our military and police departments who stand in harm’s way to protect the rest of us and our right to express ourselves.”

Worth repeating.....



“If Nike chooses to create an ad campaign featuring a former quarterback who describes cops as ‘pigs’ and makes large donations to the family of a convicted cop killer and wanted fugitive, Joanne Chesimard, who murdered New Jersey State Trooper Werner Foerster in cold blood in 1973, they are free to do so."



NJ State Trooper murdered by Joanne Chesimard of the Black Panther Party after he and his partner stopped the vehicle for a defective tail light. Joanne shot both him and his partner, then took Trooper Foerster's service revolver and shot him twice in the head, execution style. https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/11219092/werner-foerster

Trooper Foerster was survived by his wife and a 3 year-old son. He was 34 years old. https://www.njsp.org/memoriam/1970s/foerster.shtml
 

ksupoke

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#74
Kaepernick is a fraud. He originally did what he did to save his job, not risk it. Then when it became apparent that his stance might be hindering his chances all of a sudden reports came out that he would now stand if somebody signed him. I see no courage in any of that.

As far as “old white people” go. I’d bet they are one of if not Nike’s #1 customer given how much Nike stuff is bought by not only middle aged adults for themselves but for their children. It seems odd to me that after all this hurt the NFL’s ratings that the strategy is to double down.
Spot on

https://brandongaille.com/18-incredible-nike-demographic-segmentation/

Most people associate footwear with the Nike brand and rightly so. Their annual athletic footwear sales total $90 million. In comparison, Adidas moves just $25 million of footwear sales annually. In total, the global market share for Nike is expected to be over 27% by 2020. Here’s how they’re going to be able to do it.

Nike primarily targets consumers who are between 18-40 years of age.
The goal is to equip teens under the age of 20 with athletic apparel, especially in sports like football and soccer.
Nike targets households and teens that have a particular desire to look athletic and fashionable at the same time.
All socioeconomic classes are targeted as part of the segmentation of Nike’s demographics.
Most marketing occurs in the United States for Nike, but this is to increase the market share of their athletic apparel more than it is to advertise their footwear.
No single customer accounted for more than 10% of Nike’s overall sales in the last year, proving that the company has a very diversified market.
North American sales for Nike are still 2.5x greater than the next closest market, which is Western Europe.

you can go to the link for the rest of the piece
 
Jul 25, 2018
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#76
Not really. Nike is paying him megabucks for the ad campaign. They probably want to control the message. IOW, he sold out.
Yeah, but the NIKE part of this whole story is a couple of days old, whereas him & the protests are years old now.

He's the original author of the message, but has chosen virtual silence, in a day & age of media everywhere, all the time. I find this, at the very least, peculiar.
 

RxCowboy

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#77
Yeah, but the NIKE part of this whole story is a couple of days old, whereas him & the protests are years old now.

He's the original author of the message, but has chosen virtual silence, in a day & age of media everywhere, all the time. I find this, at the very least, peculiar.
Oh, he was trying to get another NFL job. I'm sure his agent had told him to tone it down. Now he's in the middle of a lawsuit with the NFL and is likely silenced by his lawyers. However, he recently gave a "black power" salute at the tennis US Open... from a luxury suite.
 

kaboy42

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#78
Oh, he was trying to get another NFL job. I'm sure his agent had told him to tone it down. Now he's in the middle of a lawsuit with the NFL and is likely silenced by his lawyers. However, he recently gave a "black power" salute at the tennis US Open... from a luxury suite.
Nothing says "oppression" like being forced to watch tennis.








From the luxury suites. :lol:
 
Jul 25, 2018
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#79
Oh, he was trying to get another NFL job. I'm sure his agent had told him to tone it down. Now he's in the middle of a lawsuit with the NFL and is likely silenced by his lawyers. However, he recently gave a "black power" salute at the tennis US Open... from a luxury suite.
I just find it interesting, with all of the media outlets out there that would be friendly to him & parrot his stance, that there hasn't been a single big interview in 3 years now. This, in & of itself, leads to the reasonable question of "okay, you've established this platform for a cause, now what?' In other words, you've created a groundswell of support within certain people, now where are you, the face of this, going with it?

I think it's a reasonable question.
 

kaboy42

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May 2, 2007
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#80
I just find it interesting, with all of the media outlets out there that would be friendly to him & parrot his stance, that there hasn't been a single big interview in 3 years now. This, in & of itself, leads to the reasonable question of "okay, you've established this platform for a cause, now what?' In other words, you've created a groundswell of support within certain people, now where are you, the face of this, going with it?

I think it's a reasonable question.
Agree! What with all the free time and all, you'd think there'd be truckloads of hours and hours of film of Kaepernick speaking at numerous panels offering solutions to the injustices. OR funding (with his own money) programs that could educate LEOs or city leaders on how to effect positive change in their communities. You know, like actually, truly "sacrifice" something.