Judgement

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kaboy42

Territorial Marshal
May 2, 2007
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#41
What does that mean to laymen specifically?

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Treating pain with purified proteins. Example: Euflexxa (Sodium Hyaluronate) is a purified protein produced by bacteria. Injected in to joints to treat pain from osteoarthritis.

Little side effects as these are normally naturally occurring proteins. And virtually no addictive properties.
 
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kaboy42

Territorial Marshal
May 2, 2007
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#42
I have friends in Colorado. They specifically know there's a massive black market and it's not just because of taxes it's because people don't want, or they go from, the stuff that's legally sold to wanting stuff that's stronger.

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So there's probably going to be a black market no matter what.
 
Sep 6, 2012
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Edmond
#43
That's crazy! Don't they sell shatter and other concentrates in CO? Aren't some of the strains like 20+ percent THC? How strong do they need?
This!!! I tried it for the first time in colorado. 1 ruptured disc, 2 torn and slipped. No one can help. Last November I had to go to the er. I told them no opioids , they gave a iv for fluids and ran blood 4500 bill for nothing. Previous to the er, I did the dr of course, he put me on a expensive gaba penton. I did the chiro, acupuncture , bought a inversion table. I finally broke down after we cancelled our 1st of 7 ski trips of the season and got some indica gummies and this cbd salve, 315 extreme relief salve. The gummies help me sleep through the pain and the salve helps A LOT and it can be purchased on Ebay. I got my card to get gummies for the nights I cant get sleep.

I went to a friends dispensary while they were having a patient drive. I went in with all my documentation like my mri results and my other treatments. It was my turn, my wife and I walk in to the office with the dr at the dispensary. I hand him my form as I ask him if he needs the formal wording for my diagnoses. He said, you can leave that blank they dont even look at that.

Personally I think the State is happy with the revenue just the licenses generated. I have heard some pretty big numbers.
 
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Jul 25, 2018
1,806
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Boulder, CO
#44
I have friends in Colorado. They specifically know there's a massive black market and it's not just because of taxes it's because people don't want, or they go from, the stuff that's legally sold to wanting stuff that's stronger.

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Being a CO resident myself, sure, a black market does exist. Having said that, & as someone who purchased from that market for years, I find it hard to believe that the black market has anywhere remotely close to the reach it did for years. With legal sales in CO regularly exceeding $100million/month, that's alot of $$ the black market will never see. Further, the sheer convenience of being able to pop into a store, shop for a variety of products & be home in no time is simply something that's far more consumer friendly than calling someone, working around their schedule, & all the hassle that's involved in most black market transactions. So, you tell me, what route are most people going to choose?

To your point about getting stronger stuff, your friends are akin to people who insist on buying moonshine, essentially. The strength of flower, concentrate, shatter, etc... that is available legally is extremely, extremely strong. In other words, they ain't sellin' 3.2 weed.
 

wrenhal

Territorial Marshal
Aug 11, 2011
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#45
I have friends in Colorado. They specifically know there's a massive black market and it's not just because of taxes it's because people don't want, or they go from, the stuff that's legally sold to wanting stuff that's stronger.

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That's crazy! Don't they sell shatter and other concentrates in CO? Aren't some of the strains like 20+ percent THC? How strong do they need?
It's the fact that it's legal and there are ALWAYS gonna be people that think illegal is better or want to do it for the thrill of being illegal. And then some that have found the legal stuff isn't as good anymore for whatever reason.

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NotOnTV

BRB -- Taking an okie leak
Sep 14, 2010
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Gondor
#46
This!!! I tried it for the first time in colorado. 1 ruptured disc, 2 torn and slipped. No one can help. Last November I had to go to the er. I told them no opioids , they gave a iv for fluids and ran blood 4500 bill for nothing. Previous to the er, I did the dr of course, he put me on a expensive gaba penton. I did the chiro, acupuncture , bought a inversion table. I finally broke down after we cancelled our 1st of 7 anki trips of the season and got some indica gummies and this cbd salve, 315 extreme relief salve. The gummies help me sleep through the pain and the salve helps A LOT and it can be purchased on Ebay. I got my card to get gummies for the nights I cant get sleep.

I went to a friends dispensary while they were having a patient drive. I went in with all my documentation like my mri results and my other treatments. It was my turn, my wife and I walk in to the office with the dr at the dispensary. I hand him my form as I ask him if he needs the formal wording for my diagnoses. He said, you can leave that blank they dont even look at that.

Personally I think the State is happy with the revenue just the licenses generated. I have heard some pretty big numbers.
Ah yes...the notorious indica gummies! :D

Does one have to be a resident of Oklahoma to get a medical card? Asking for a friend.
 

steross

Bookface/Instagran legend
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#49
This!!! I tried it for the first time in colorado. 1 ruptured disc, 2 torn and slipped. No one can help. Last November I had to go to the er. I told them no opioids , they gave a iv for fluids and ran blood 4500 bill for nothing. Previous to the er, I did the dr of course, he put me on a expensive gaba penton. I did the chiro, acupuncture , bought a inversion table. I finally broke down after we cancelled our 1st of 7 ski trips of the season and got some indica gummies and this cbd salve, 315 extreme relief salve. The gummies help me sleep through the pain and the salve helps A LOT and it can be purchased on Ebay. I got my card to get gummies for the nights I cant get sleep.

I went to a friends dispensary while they were having a patient drive. I went in with all my documentation like my mri results and my other treatments. It was my turn, my wife and I walk in to the office with the dr at the dispensary. I hand him my form as I ask him if he needs the formal wording for my diagnoses. He said, you can leave that blank they dont even look at that.

Personally I think the State is happy with the revenue just the licenses generated. I have heard some pretty big numbers.
I'm happy to hear that you have found something safe that at least helps with the pain.

I think those claiming this is all just a cover for recreational use do not know what they are talking about.
 
Jul 25, 2018
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Boulder, CO
#50
I'm happy to hear that you have found something safe that at least helps with the pain.

I think those claiming this is all just a cover for recreational use do not know what they are talking about.
Have to agree with this. I've had patients with chronic conditions (many in their 60's & 70's) who'll say that CBD & sometimes THC give them relief that they've been unable to find with other meds. There's definitely some legitimacy to the effectiveness of both, imo.
 

bleedinorange

Federal Marshal
Jan 11, 2010
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In Pokey's head
#51
I have nothing to contribute because irrespective of my discomfort I've opted out of all but OTC meds. Took one opioid (percodan) one time 48 years ago. Knew immediately not to get involved


See? No addiction. Not complicated. I would not have supported the verdict if I were on the jury.
 

wrenhal

Territorial Marshal
Aug 11, 2011
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#52
This!!! I tried it for the first time in colorado. 1 ruptured disc, 2 torn and slipped. No one can help. Last November I had to go to the er. I told them no opioids , they gave a iv for fluids and ran blood 4500 bill for nothing. Previous to the er, I did the dr of course, he put me on a expensive gaba penton. I did the chiro, acupuncture , bought a inversion table. I finally broke down after we cancelled our 1st of 7 ski trips of the season and got some indica gummies and this cbd salve, 315 extreme relief salve. The gummies help me sleep through the pain and the salve helps A LOT and it can be purchased on Ebay. I got my card to get gummies for the nights I cant get sleep.

I went to a friends dispensary while they were having a patient drive. I went in with all my documentation like my mri results and my other treatments. It was my turn, my wife and I walk in to the office with the dr at the dispensary. I hand him my form as I ask him if he needs the formal wording for my diagnoses. He said, you can leave that blank they dont even look at that.

Personally I think the State is happy with the revenue just the licenses generated. I have heard some pretty big numbers.
I'm happy to hear that you have found something safe that at least helps with the pain.

I think those claiming this is all just a cover for recreational use do not know what they are talking about.
I'm sorry, but there's no way that there aren't tons of recreational users getting a crackpot guy over the phone or one who goes from town to town like a snake oil salesmen, to issue them a card.

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steross

Bookface/Instagran legend
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#53
I'm sorry, but there's no way that there aren't tons of recreational users getting a crackpot guy over the phone or one who goes from town to town like a snake oil salesmen, to issue them a card.

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Not mutually exclusive.
 

wrenhal

Territorial Marshal
Aug 11, 2011
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#54
I'm happy to hear that you have found something safe that at least helps with the pain.

I think those claiming this is all just a cover for recreational use do not know what they are talking about.
Have to agree with this. I've had patients with chronic conditions (many in their 60's & 70's) who'll say that CBD & sometimes THC give them relief that they've been unable to find with other meds. There's definitely some legitimacy to the effectiveness of both, imo.
I don't doubt that it helps some people. But the groups that were behind the push for legalization were the same ones that pushed for rec. They were served with a different route this time and we're backed by dispensary companies and the stories of people that had been helped. They used those people to get the foot in the door. And they'll push for rec use again.

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jakeman

Unhinged Idiot
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#55
I don't doubt that it helps some people. But the groups that were behind the push for legalization were the same ones that pushed for rec. They were served with a different route this time and we're backed by dispensary companies and the stories of people that had been helped. They used those people to get the foot in the door. And they'll push for rec use again.

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Anecdotal, but of the dozens, and I mean dozens of the people I know with a card, 1 guy and 1 older lady got it for medical reasons. They claim they are helped by it, and I think they should have it.

Seeing the doc on the iPad in a back office of the dispensary to get the script is a little shady. All the guys I've talked to, and I've talked to a bunch of them, that have done it said they weren't even asked why they wanted it. Is it helping some people with real medical issues? Sure it is. Are the majority of the people with cards using it for recreation? Of course they are. I don't have any issues with it. But, if you smoke for what ever reason, and you live in OK and you don't go get a card, you're an idiot. It's a "don't go to jail card", and the way the law is written, if you've got any and you have a card, you're free to go along your merry, stoned way.

If you smoke, go get a card. It takes about 10 minutes and it's cheaper than getting arrested for having a couple of joints.

Again, I don't smoke. I ain't gonna smoke, but the law still needs some work. If you go get your card, you shouldn't forfeit your Constitutional right to possess a firearm. They need to fix that. Maybe eventually the GOP will get that right, and fold at the federal level and stop the draconian laws that prevent it from being legal.
 

steross

Bookface/Instagran legend
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#56
I don't doubt that it helps some people. But the groups that were behind the push for legalization were the same ones that pushed for rec. They were served with a different route this time and we're backed by dispensary companies and the stories of people that had been helped. They used those people to get the foot in the door. And they'll push for rec use again.

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Thanks for stating the obvious.

And the groups behind people wanting to gamble are pushed and funded by the casino industry.
And the groups wanting hunting rights are pushed and funded by gun manufacturers even though it isn't all about hunting.
And the groups wanting to "protect" patients from Walmart having optometrists were pushed and backed by the independent optometry associations not just people with bad eyes.

Is there ever a time in politics where something major happens based on some tiny group that did not gain the support of a larger industry? I really can't see what your point is other than it sounds like sour grapes for some reason.

And, of course they will push for rec again. That is what they do for a living. What industry are you in? Can you show me a time where that industry lobbied against its own interests?
 
Jul 25, 2018
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Boulder, CO
#57
I don't doubt that it helps some people. But the groups that were behind the push for legalization were the same ones that pushed for rec. They were served with a different route this time and we're backed by dispensary companies and the stories of people that had been helped. They used those people to get the foot in the door. And they'll push for rec use again.

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Again, I live in a state where we have both & have already gone through this process. I'm well aware of how it works.
 

steross

Bookface/Instagran legend
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#58
Seeing the doc on the iPad in a back office of the dispensary to get the script is a little shady. All the guys I've talked to, and I've talked to a bunch of them, that have done it said they weren't even asked why they wanted it. Is it helping some people with real medical issues? Sure it is. Are the majority of the people with cards using it for recreation? Of course they are. I don't have any issues with it. But, if you smoke for what ever reason, and you live in OK and you don't go get a card, you're an idiot. It's a "don't go to jail card", and the way the law is written, if you've got any and you have a card, you're free to go along your merry, stoned way.
A doctor that doesn't even ask is simply breaking the law. I know docs/NPs/PAs that will call in an antibiotic for people just because they call the office with a sore throat. Even though the vast majority of them are viruses and the antibiotic can do nothing but harm. Having a degree doesn't stop stupid.

And, I disagree that it is "the majority" using it for only recreation. Obviously, there is no way to prove that, but I disagree with the contention.

Years ago, when I was an intern in military hospitals we could prescribe a 6 pack of beer (budweiser) for anxiety. Now, turns out that alcohol while short term helpful for some anxiety is not an ideal med for it and that prescribing no longer exists. Cannabis is similar in that it can be used recreationally and medically. It appears now for some people for some issues it is better than the alternatives. Time will tell if it goes the way of alcohol for anxiety or if it becomes more accepted medically. Recreationally, with time I think it will be accepted like alcohol. Certainly, the dependence rates and side effect profile would say it should be.
 

jakeman

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#59
Cannabis is similar in that it can be used recreationally and medically. It appears now for some people for some issues it is better than the alternatives. Time will tell if it goes the way of alcohol for anxiety or if it becomes more accepted medically. Recreationally, with time I think it will be accepted like alcohol. Certainly, the dependence rates and side effect profile would say it should be.
Couldn't agree more.
 

Donnyboy

Lettin' the high times carry the low....
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#60
A doctor that doesn't even ask is simply breaking the law. I know docs/NPs/PAs that will call in an antibiotic for people just because they call the office with a sore throat. Even though the vast majority of them are viruses and the antibiotic can do nothing but harm. Having a degree doesn't stop stupid.

And, I disagree that it is "the majority" using it for only recreation. Obviously, there is no way to prove that, but I disagree with the contention.

Years ago, when I was an intern in military hospitals we could prescribe a 6 pack of beer (budweiser) for anxiety. Now, turns out that alcohol while short term helpful for some anxiety is not an ideal med for it and that prescribing no longer exists. Cannabis is similar in that it can be used recreationally and medically. It appears now for some people for some issues it is better than the alternatives. Time will tell if it goes the way of alcohol for anxiety or if it becomes more accepted medically. Recreationally, with time I think it will be accepted like alcohol. Certainly, the dependence rates and side effect profile would say it should be.
I agree with your sentiment that it doesn't have to be mutually exclusive from those that benefit from the medicinal properties and just use the loop hole but the med weed push is just the vehicle to get it legal and the evidence is in the claims for all it cures, the way it's distributed, and the immediate push from the lobby for recreational use after med laws are passed. My little home town now has 5 dispensaries......there are 10 restaurants....Walmart shut down the local pharmacy. There is no way the fine citizens have the 50% the demand for as many retailers of one single type of medicine as they do prepared food. When you do get your weed script you don't go to a pharmacy where someone with post graduate study in the science works with specially trained technicians to get carefully controlled or compounded meds you go talk to a stoner about candy, brownies, vape juice, strains that undergo no FDA testing for potency, side effects, or impact on your ailment. The doc doesn't say you need x amount of this property which can be found in x product at such such intervals a day to help with this specific ailment he gives you a script and the dude behind the counter says "hey man check this shit out"....."what king of high do you like for your pain, loss of appetite, anxiety, glaucoma, depression, bulimia, cancer, or nothing because there are no qualifying conditions."......or to your spot on antibiotic example even when prescribed recklessly you get an exact dosage and interval of time. Weed is the equivalent of calling the doc and saying I have a fever and them say "the maximum amount of antibiotics you can have is 72oz of edible form so go have that guy with no scientific training give you a 4.5 lb bag antibiotic candy of an any strength you like....you can get some penicillin bears but if you really want to kick it's ass check out the vanomycin rice crispy treats ."

Undeniably marijuana has medicinal uses and I think it is great especially that people are turning to it instead of opioids......hemp has a shit ton of commercial uses......recreational weed is less dangerous in pretty much every way than the abuse of alcohol......we have wasted billions on enforcement. I'm for the outright legalization of it.....but that's what the medical movement is about. It's the immediate next step in every state that opens the door through the medical avenue.