How do we fix the bowls?

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Jul 25, 2018
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#42
I like the bowls. I love watching them during the time off at the holidays. Less college football is never the answer.
Exactly.

Do bowls 'mean' as much as they used to? No, but they're entertainment so what's wrong with having more of them?

It's a matter of taste, but I'd still rather watch about any random bowl than a December NBA game & most college BB games, & so do a lot of other people, as evidenced by the ratings.
 
Jan 15, 2017
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#43
Are bowls really broken though?
Is it really that big of deal that a few players opt out from a team each year? Do OSU fans only want to watch Chuba Hubbard play or do OSU fans want to watch OSU play? Does it give a chance for younger plays to play and provide hope for the next season?
Does winning or losing a bowl game make any difference for the next season? LSU won their bowl, Clemson and Alabama lost in the playoffs before winning.
2019 we lost - 2020 8-3
2018 we won - 2019 8-5
2017 we won -2018 7-6
2016 we won - 2017 10-3
2015 we lost - 2016 10-3
 
Sep 12, 2013
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#44
More importantly ...2011.

(11 am Central)Orange Bowl: Clemson vs Boise State
(2 pm Central)Sugar Bowl: LSU vs Stanford
(5 pm Central)Rose: Oregon vs Wisconsin
(8 pm Central)Fiesta Bowl: Oklahoma State vs Alabama
Ummm, with 8 teams #1 (Alabama) does not play #3 (Okla State) nor does #2 (LSU) play #4 (Stanford).

1 vs 8
2 vs 7
3 vs 6
4 vs 5
 
Oct 30, 2007
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#45
https://247sports.com/Article/mack-...bowl-games-north-carolina-football-158518359/
Mack Brown reportedly calls for playoff expansion amid opt-outs

"This is totally different than what anybody has ever dealt with," Brown said, per Hale, when discussing opt-outs. "I think the No. 1 thing we need to look at is expansion of the playoff. Not one playoff player opted out. Why guys aren't opting out of the playoff but they opt out of the top bowl games, I don't know. It's all about getting hurt, and you can sure get hurt in the playoff. If we expand it, it will help some of the other bowls.
 
Jul 25, 2018
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#46
Are bowls really broken though?
Is it really that big of deal that a few players opt out from a team each year? Do OSU fans only want to watch Chuba Hubbard play or do OSU fans want to watch OSU play? Does it give a chance for younger plays to play and provide hope for the next season?
Does winning or losing a bowl game make any difference for the next season? LSU won their bowl, Clemson and Alabama lost in the playoffs before winning.
2019 we lost - 2020 8-3
2018 we won - 2019 8-5
2017 we won -2018 7-6
2016 we won - 2017 10-3
2015 we lost - 2016 10-3

It's become a popular talking point this season: "the emphasis on making the CFP has devalued all the other bowls..." It's like other talking points that start somewhere, then you see & hear others jumping on board with that opinion.

It's a fair point, but can you really stop it? I mean, how do you go back to making a 'Big Monday' a big deal again in college BB when the vast majority of interest is on March Madness? For players opting out, how do you go back to a time where kids thought they had to play every snap of every game to maximize their NFL value?

Simple answer is: you can't. It's simply longing for the good ole days & ignoring today's reality.
 
Apr 12, 2020
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#47
More importantly ...2011.

(11 am Central)Orange Bowl: Clemson vs Boise State
(2 pm Central)Sugar Bowl: LSU vs Stanford
(5 pm Central)Rose: Oregon vs Wisconsin
(8 pm Central)Fiesta Bowl: Oklahoma State vs Alabama
Ummm, with 8 teams #1 (Alabama) does not play #3 (Okla State) nor does #2 (LSU) play #4 (Stanford).

1 vs 8
2 vs 7
3 vs 6
4 vs 5
LSU was the one going into the 2011 National championship game undefeated, not Bama.
1 vs 4 is LSU vs Stanford
2 vs 3 is Oklahoma State vs Bama.
The others don’t matter.


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OrangeFan69

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Apr 24, 2010
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#49
A lot of the bowls (at least half?) need to be flushed. There are so many it has watered down what was recognition of teams for a good season. We would have just the right number of bowls when three or four teams are complaining they weren't picked for one.

It would be difficult to dramatically expand the playoffs without cutting at least a game out of the regular season, and I don't see that happening.
How does the New Mexico Or whatever bowl downgrade another bowl we are playing in?

 
Nov 8, 2013
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#50
We need to stop referring to bowls as "exhibition games" unless all games that don't have a direct impact on the eventual championship (such as a game like a late season match-up between Kansas and Texas Tech) are considered exhibition games. Bowl games are some of the BEST cross-conference match-ups and should be appreciated as much as pre-conference cross-conference games.
 
Jul 25, 2018
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#51
How does the New Mexico Or whatever bowl downgrade another bowl we are playing in?

Well, he's not totally wrong in the sense that yes, there are obviously a lot more bowls today, so no, it's not some exclusive achievement anymore. Thing is, it hasn't been for years now, so it's clinging to some notion from the past to feel that a bowl represents some special season now.

As has been spelled out multiple times, however, the bowls are programming for ESPN, not some special sanctioned event. I have no problem with the number of them, the more the merrier, imo. Moving forward, though, it'll be interesting to see where ESPN is in a few years on the bowls. Their cutbacks & losses are inevitably going to impact their decisions on bowls & we may see a world where they don't own all but 4 of them. Does FOX get heavier into the bowl business? Who knows?
 
Jul 25, 2018
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#52
We need to stop referring to bowls as "exhibition games" unless all games that don't have a direct impact on the eventual championship (such as a game like a late season match-up between Kansas and Texas Tech) are considered exhibition games. Bowl games are some of the BEST cross-conference match-ups and should be appreciated as much as pre-conference cross-conference games.
Can't they be both?
 
Aug 16, 2012
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#53
How does the New Mexico Or whatever bowl downgrade another bowl we are playing in?

Bowl games have always, back to the 1902 Rose Bowl, been tourism efforts. The NCAA does not create them, private industry and municipalities developed and operate them. That being said, those selected to play have traditionally been the best teams of a season. They became rewards for teams that accomplished something during the regular season and were eventually used to determine a national champion.

Now they are a game available, seriously, to teams with sub-500 records (and not just this year), and teams with .500 or +1 records have played in just about every bowl game except those that are now part of the NY6 and championship. Going bowling does not have the same meaning as it used to since the number of games has doubled in the past 20 year. Think of it this way. You go out and buy a brand new Aeon JPX-921 Vindicator Coupe and are the envy of the neighborhood. The following year, there are dozens of driveways with them and yours? Meh, who cares, everyone has one.

Did a quick look and in OSU's bowl streak, and we fell into that "meh" category more times than I had realized.

Year / Record going into the bowl / Conference record
2006 / 6-6 / 3-5
2007 / 6-6 / 4-4
2014 / 6-6 / 4-5
2018 / 6-6 / 3-6

Not singling out OSU because bowls are what bowls are, but a team that does not even go .500 in conference and just makes .500 overall does not warrant any sort of reward....if the bowls are held based on merit.
 
Jul 25, 2018
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#54
Bowl games have always, back to the 1902 Rose Bowl, been tourism efforts. The NCAA does not create them, private industry and municipalities developed and operate them. That being said, those selected to play have traditionally been the best teams of a season. They became rewards for teams that accomplished something during the regular season and were eventually used to determine a national champion.

Now they are a game available, seriously, to teams with sub-500 records (and not just this year), and teams with .500 or +1 records have played in just about every bowl game except those that are now part of the NY6 and championship. Going bowling does not have the same meaning as it used to since the number of games has doubled in the past 20 year. Think of it this way. You go out and buy a brand new Aeon JPX-921 Vindicator Coupe and are the envy of the neighborhood. The following year, there are dozens of driveways with them and yours? Meh, who cares, everyone has one.

Did a quick look and in OSU's bowl streak, and we fell into that "meh" category more times than I had realized.

Year / Record going into the bowl / Conference record
2006 / 6-6 / 3-5
2007 / 6-6 / 4-4
2014 / 6-6 / 4-5
2018 / 6-6 / 3-6

Not singling out OSU because bowls are what bowls are, but a team that does not even go .500 in conference and just makes .500 overall does not warrant any sort of reward....if the bowls are held based on merit.
Agree with most of what you're saying, but the market says they do merit a reward.

It's similar to expanding the BB tourney, imo, & yes, I do realize the much higher % of FB teams that make bowls.
 
Aug 16, 2012
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#55
Agree with most of what you're saying, but the market says they do merit a reward.

It's similar to expanding the BB tourney, imo, & yes, I do realize the much higher % of FB teams that make bowls.
eeehhhh, I think the market says they can make money and NCAA teams are just a tool for doing so.

IMO, the main difference between March Madness and the bowl games is the bracket play. A lot of people will watch a 16-seed that they otherwise would not if there is the chance they can knock off a ranked team.

Cannot gauge much this year though. Viewer numbers were up, quite significantly in some instances, but with COVID, there are a lot more butts in front of the TV now so who knows if it was interest or boredom. Will be interesting to see the financial impact on the organizers who held the games to partial crowds and if they will all be able to absorb any losses and keep operating.
 
Jul 25, 2018
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#56
eeehhhh, I think the market says they can make money and NCAA teams are just a tool for doing so.

IMO, the main difference between March Madness and the bowl games is the bracket play. A lot of people will watch a 16-seed that they otherwise would not if there is the chance they can knock off a ranked team.

Cannot gauge much this year though. Viewer numbers were up, quite significantly in some instances, but with COVID, there are a lot more butts in front of the TV now so who knows if it was interest or boredom. Will be interesting to see the financial impact on the organizers who held the games to partial crowds and if they will all be able to absorb any losses and keep operating.
The interesting thing about the numbers is that most thought the NBA numbers would be significantly up, given the butts stuck at home, but their numbers fell off a cliff. Won't derail the thread with why that might have been, but it definitely left media analysts scratching their heads on why the numbers were SO bad.

To your point about interest in March Madness vs. a singular bowl game, I agree. Having said that, though, we're talking about, let's say, Tuesday December 21st. ESPN needs programming. Viewers need programming. Boom, here's a college bowl game created & owned by them, & more people have interest in that than any other sporting event taking place that day/night. More than any NBA or NHL game & the vast majority of college BB games.

So the bowl games aren't competing against the entire sports calendar, they're simply filling a pretty non-interesting, non-consequential part of the year.
 
Jul 9, 2011
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earrth
#57
How does the New Mexico Or whatever bowl downgrade another bowl we are playing in?

In a normal season, not counting the NC Game there are now 39 bowl games. That's 78 of the 130 FBS Division I teams playing in bowl games. Bowls are having a difficult time filling them with teams that have an above .500 record. Outside of some alums from the schools involved, who cares? In fact, a number of the lesser bowls drew 15,000 fans or less - so apparently not many of the alums were very interested either. Overall bowl attendance is down versus past years because bowl game overload.

Fewer bowl games overall would focus more attention/hype/coverage of the remaining bowl games, and might get some of the magic back.
 
Jul 25, 2018
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#58
In a normal season, not counting the NC Game there are now 39 bowl games. That's 78 of the 130 FBS Division I teams playing in bowl games. Bowls are having a difficult time filling them with teams that have an above .500 record. Outside of some alums from the schools involved, who cares? In fact, a number of the lesser bowls drew 15,000 fans or less - so apparently not many of the alums were very interested either. Overall bowl attendance is down versus past years because bowl game overload.
Are you talking about this year's bowl attendance? That's obviously an outlier to any previous year, so comparing attendance in ANYTHING this year would seem a little silly.

The schools are on the hook for X number of seats at a bowl game, so there are bowls that have more seats sold than butts in the seats sometimes. It's the way the bowls guarantee their ticket sales. ESPN owns the bowls, so they own the rights too & sell advertising off of those rights, which bring them eyeballs when they broadcast the games. As I've pointed out & the ratings show, they'll get more eyeballs for a college bowl game than literally any sporting event going on at the time.
 
Jul 9, 2011
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earrth
#59
Are you talking about this year's bowl attendance? That's obviously an outlier to any previous year, so comparing attendance in ANYTHING this year would seem a little silly.

The schools are on the hook for X number of seats at a bowl game, so there are bowls that have more seats sold than butts in the seats sometimes. It's the way the bowls guarantee their ticket sales. ESPN owns the bowls, so they own the rights too & sell advertising off of those rights, which bring them eyeballs when they broadcast the games. As I've pointed out & the ratings show, they'll get more eyeballs for a college bowl game than literally any sporting event going on at the time.
No, 2019 and before on a bowl by bowl basis. Attendance at existing bowls and the playoff bowls was down.