Cali says buh-bye to internal combustion engine automobiles.

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Pokit N

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Sep 29, 2006
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#41
Question:. Will california not allow out of state trucking companies to drive through the state, delivering in goods to the state or transporting out goods to other states? What about things that arrive in CA ports that are going to other states?
Truckers already have to deal w/ a host of issues if they want to drive into and out of the state of CA. It's a huge PITA. This will only may it worse, much worse actually.
 

Donnyboy

Lettin' the high times carry the low....
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#42
They will accomplish this with caveats and probably not be any ahead of natural market functions....how many electric cars did you see 15 years ago 2035 is a looooooong ways away. Their claim to go 100% renewable electricity production is a couple of years behind.....at best.....and they still import a ton of power from WEC which they claim as renewable because the end user purchases credits but is actually fossil produced
 
Feb 15, 2017
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#43
As a backyard gardener, I"m having a hard time getting a handle on this statement. I walk out my back door in the spring and put the seeds in the ground. In 3 months I walk back out and pick the veggies and walk them back into my kitchen. How in the world would my emissions be higher?
I'm sure it is a wide range of CO2 footprint for back yard gardens and some are more and some are less than mass producers.

But add it all up:
you drive to/from Lowes and to buy the seeds
your seeds come in a small package vs a large supersack- a lot more package waste
repeat above for fertilizer
repeat above for building a wood frame around the garden bed or tomato planter/pot
use any plastic or wooden tools to prepare the bed ?
how much water/pound do you use compared to a mass producer ?
 
Nov 6, 2010
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#44
I'm sure it is a wide range of CO2 footprint for back yard gardens and some are more and some are less than mass producers.

But add it all up:
you drive to/from Lowes and to buy the seeds
your seeds come in a small package vs a large supersack- a lot more package waste
repeat above for fertilizer
repeat above for building a wood frame around the garden bed or tomato planter/pot
use any plastic or wooden tools to prepare the bed ?
how much water/pound do you use compared to a mass producer ?
Luckily I'm a very lazy gardener, no raised beds or pots and rarely fertilize. I have a few cages for my tomatoes but I re-use them every year, so I think I'm probably on the low end. I could see what you're getting at though for folks that go all out.
 
Feb 15, 2017
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#46
At Tuscia University in Viterbo, Italy, environmental scholar Giampiero Grossi said methane emitted by ruminant livestock accounts for about 5.5% of the greenhouse gasses that come from human activity.

5.5% would rank #3 in the world as a country
 
Feb 15, 2017
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#47
Luckily I'm a very lazy gardener, no raised beds or pots and rarely fertilize. I have a few cages for my tomatoes but I re-use them every year, so I think I'm probably on the low end. I could see what you're getting at though for folks that go all out.
And LCA goes on:

the Lowe's employee has to drive to the store to sell the seeds/fertilizer
the trucker that has to bring them to Lowes,
etc.

Same tasks for large farms but they get the benefit of economy of scale.
 

SLVRBK

Johnny 8ball's PR Manager
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#51
I'm equating people's first reaction to be WHAT ABOUT THE BILLIONAIRES?!?!?!?!?
Interesting, I don’t read it that way. I do see people who live in other states wondering how it will affect their lives because California’s decision will have national effects. Then standard questions of how to supply and distribute the additional electricity needed. One post on putting oil companies out of business caused the discussion to veer into into how energy companies are shifting but this has little to do with California as it has been underway for a number of years.

My question on whether Cali would allow the sale of a gas powered vehicle with a lifecycle carbon footprint equal or better than an electric is a serious question.
 

Rack

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#55
I'm equating people's first reaction to be WHAT ABOUT THE BILLIONAIRES?!?!?!?!?
I'm not a billionaire or even a millionaire yet, but I'm concerned regarding my retirement and the energy sector. You have a 401K orange? 15 years really isn't that long...are we going to have to park our SUV's at the boarder of California because they won't let it in the state? What's that going to do for California's real issues? High real estate prices, over taxation, homelessness, high crime, and an open boarder? I have nothing against attempting to go to a cleaner burning fuel, just not sure setting drop dead dates on it is a good idea at all.

Maybe Cali should get a handle on their rolling blackouts and put some dang power plants in the state before they say they are going to go all electrical when they can't even produce electricity? Maybe the state should try to keep their electrical car producer from bolting from the state?

It's hypocritical pandering to say "Hey LOOK AT US we are doing something about the environment!"... when in reality they aren't doing a damn thing to help with the fires or the environment except talking big and setting dates that mean absolutely nothing except for pandering to illogical reasoning and bad science. try harvesting some of the forest (especially the dead stuff) and controlled burns without an overburdening amount of paper work. Try prosecuting offenders who set fire with MAXIMUM time and punishment. Setting an arbitrary date doesn't do anything for next fire season or the next one or the one in 2035 even.
 
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OrangeFan69

LA Face with an Okla. booty.
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#56
I'm not a billionaire or even a millionaire yet, but I'm concerned regarding my retirement and the energy sector. You have a 401K orange?
I'm in the Screen Actors Guild pension fund, a 403b from an education adjacent job and Southern California Real Estate. I index my investments and aim not to tie into any one industry.

I know I am not smart enough to outsmart the Ivy leaguers.
 

Rack

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#57
I Googled real quick....

The least expensive electric vehicle is the Mini Cooper SE at around $31k MSRP.

Is that “affordable” for the majority of Cali’s population?
1601324913611.png

Sad truth for far too many these days in the big cities...even in San Diego it's a big problem...hope they can get back on track soon.
 
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Rack

Legendary Cowboy
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#58
I'm in the Screen Actors Guild pension fund, a 403b from an education adjacent job and Southern California Real Estate. I index my investments and aim not to tie into any one industry.

I know I am not smart enough to outsmart the Ivy leaguers.
Those should be good options...I'm not tied into the energy market completely either but it is a national defense issue for us to be a leader in the industry. I don't think we should be against progress in energy...I'm not, I just think there are much better ways to help the environment quicker than this date setting distraction from the real problems. Just my opinion. Can it foster change? Maybe, but I just think it's pandering. What do you think about "politically motivated" (IMHO) date setting? Why do you think it's good, bad, or do you also think it's a copout/distraction? Have you seen the debates about electrical car production causing much more C02 on the onset and lithium strip mining? This C02 and stirp mining happens prior to a single mile being put on the car...Fossil fuel burning cars cause their pollution during use, electrical ones do in advance of their use, during production.

As a kid I used to draw up massive air "filters" with fans inside them to draw in the exhaust from along California highways... so I'm certainly for ideas to help save the air we breath. I think most people want that...just not to be forced into it in illogical ways that really don't do that and cause other, unseen by the consumer, problems.

Lithium mining for future "clean" driving electrical car batteries...ain't it Purdy?:vomit:
1601326979194.png
 
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Apr 7, 2006
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#59
The green movement in this country is one of the biggest lies there is. Amazon and Google acting like they're going to be Net 0 carbon emissions, California's nonsense - it has just begun. The false narrative that they aren't using petroleum products or having significant environmental impact- regardless of what they label the energy is inaccurate. The reality is the wind, solar and battery technology must experience a revolutionary shift to even sniff the energy production of fossil fuels and the environmental impacts of bringing "green" energy to scale is beyond the imagination of most.

https://www.manhattan-institute.org/green-energy-revolution-near-impossible

I'm all in favor of diversified energy, but the decisions have to be informed and not based on PR or politics.
 
Sep 22, 2011
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#60
https://marketplace.spp.org/pages/generation-mix

Wind is currently generating about 50% of the energy being used by the SPP

Don't listen to the blowhards on the coasts, Wind has been growing steadily for the last 5 years and will most likely be overtaken by solar in the next 5 years. we are probably going to hit the Paris accord targets for the US with the government doing nothing. The next step of the process that the government could help with is electrical infrastructure, even before the boom in renewable energy, experts have been sounding the alarm on how old and outdated our Grid is, if you want keep moving forward on renewable energy then we need to bring our grid into the 21st century