Buckle Up - Oil Markets are in Upheaval

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Bowers2

Stackin' Joe's Cups
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Jul 31, 2006
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Edmond
#21
Putin just sparked an oil price war with Saudi Arabia — and US energy companies may be the victims

Debt is the problem. The U.S. oil and gas industry has about $86 billion of rated debt due in the next four years, according to Moody’s. Nearly all of that debt is either junk rated, or rated just above junk. Fifty-seven percent of that is due in just the next two years. As oil prices fall and credit markets tighten, many companies won’t be able to refinance their debts or extend maturities.

Time is the only friend many companies now have. Most energy debt isn’t due until 2022, so some producers may be able to hang on, hoping for a turn. But if a turn doesn’t come, it will be brutal. Energy executive Dan Pickering tweeted out Friday, “Maturities are a bit further out .. 2021/2022 will be Armageddon if current environment holds through 2020.”
 
Sep 22, 2011
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#22
For you greenies out there.

Take a walk around your house. Do you see all that stuff around your house like furniture, food, clothes, appliances, windows, walls, paint, toys, jewelry, chemicals, counter-tops, carpet, tile, etc, etc? Then take a drive (or hike, or bike ride) around your neighborhood and town. Now, you see all the roads, buildings, houses, signs, sewers, fire hydrants, bridges, sidewalks, parks, cars, buses, planes, trains, etc, etc?
All of the aforementioned “things” are only comprised of three basic elements - (1) raw, naturally occurring material, (2) time, and (3) energy. Thus “energy” is a massive cost component of most EVERYTHING you see, taste, touch, smell and consume.
The economy is massively leveraged to the cost of energy. So when you wish for green energy now, you’re actually wishing to increase the cost of every single useful item in the universe. And guess who benefits, and guess who suffers?

Owners of energy providers benefit. Consumers suffer.

And guess who suffers most? The guy that can’t afford stuff now.

So now you can at least (somewhat) understand what your asking for.


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have you had out of the ordinary rate increases on your power bill in the last 5 years? because wind has gone from <5% penetration to 30% average and 70% maximum in that time. They would not be investing a billion dollars in wind turbines in Oklahoma if they could not compete in the energy market.
 
Feb 6, 2007
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#23
It boggles my mind how the Republican party has zero interest in green technology. Obama paved the way for green technology that would've had an impact of at least(!!) $2 trillion dollars. Of course, here comes the knuckle-dragging Donald "The Chump' Trump issuing executive order to literally eliminate every single green technology policy Obama's administration successfully implemented. Had Trump not done that, there would be at least 2-million more jobs in green industry than the entire US oil industry. Trump basically set us back to the 1900's. And guess who the world turned to, instead of the US because of Trump? You guessed it.. China. Trump literally robbed our economy of trillions of dollars and handed it to China. What God damn fool Trump and the Republican party truly are.

Whilst the rest of the world have invested heavily in transforming their carbon infrastructure into green infrastructure, Trump literally destroyed any hope the US ever had in transforming our crumbling infrastructure. And y'all are were just a-okau with that. I mean, Trump used "I'll rebuild our infrastructure," which obviously was a flat-out lie. Instead, Trump GUARANTEED our crumbling infrastructure would remain steadfast in its deterioration! Y'all love propaganda, for some reason
The Republican party is a god damn disease upon this country. Good job, all you Republicans. Give yourselves a 'round of applause, champs. Stop voting against green technology, and setting us back countless decades.

And why did Trump do that? To win the state of Pennsylvania during election time. What a fool.
Have a Snickers bar. "Green" is not always green, or black (as in ink). Solar is becoming economically competitive, but wind cannot compete without significant federal subsidies. Many of the corporate profits, meaning U.S. taxpayer dollars, wind up overseas in Italy, Spain, The Netherlands, Sweden, etc. Not always so "green" when you put a pencil to it.
 
Sep 22, 2011
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#24
Have a Snickers bar. "Green" is not always green, or black (as in ink). Solar is becoming economically competitive, but wind cannot compete without significant federal subsidies. Many of the corporate profits, meaning U.S. taxpayer dollars, wind up overseas in Italy, Spain, The Netherlands, Sweden, etc. Not always so "green" when you put a pencil to it.
The people who are actually making money off of wind PTCs are the banks and investment funds who are buying the tax credits. The PTCs sunset this year, do you see development slowing down? Its actually still increasing, that means one of 2 things, either they "know" that the PTCs will be extended or they feel that they can continue growing without them. You can believe whatever you want to, but the reality on the ground is that Wind and solar are winning because they are becoming the low cost alternative, will they get us to a 100% greenhouse gas free world, probably not, but every wind farm that is put up gets us a bit closer, just like every btu produced by natural gas instead of coal gets us a bit closer. I would suggest reading the book "More from Less", the US is much closer to carbon neutrality than you may realize.
 
Sep 29, 2011
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Breckenridge, CO
#26
For you greenies out there.

Take a walk around your house. Do you see all that stuff around your house like furniture, food, clothes, appliances, windows, walls, paint, toys, jewelry, chemicals, counter-tops, carpet, tile, etc, etc? Then take a drive (or hike, or bike ride) around your neighborhood and town. Now, you see all the roads, buildings, houses, signs, sewers, fire hydrants, bridges, sidewalks, parks, cars, buses, planes, trains, etc, etc?
All of the aforementioned “things” are only comprised of three basic elements - (1) raw, naturally occurring material, (2) time, and (3) energy. Thus “energy” is a massive cost component of most EVERYTHING you see, taste, touch, smell and consume.
The economy is massively leveraged to the cost of energy. So when you wish for green energy now, you’re actually wishing to increase the cost of every single useful item in the universe. And guess who benefits, and guess who suffers?

Owners of energy providers benefit. Consumers suffer.

And guess who suffers most? The guy that can’t afford stuff now.

So now you can at least (somewhat) understand what your asking for.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
have you had out of the ordinary rate increases on your power bill in the last 5 years? because wind has gone from QUOTE]


They can only compete economically because of government subsidies and tax credits, and consumers subscribing to the more expensive wind power.

I was required by the city to install solar on my current house. The cost was $24k. The value of my annual electric generation is less than $300. Just a scam.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Nov 16, 2013
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tractor
#27
have you had out of the ordinary rate increases on your power bill in the last 5 years? because wind has gone from <5% penetration to 30% average and 70% maximum in that time. They would not be investing a billion dollars in wind turbines in Oklahoma if they could not compete in the energy market.
They can compete because they get federal and state tax subsidies that no other industry receives.
 

Jostate

CPTNQUIRK called me a greenhorn
A/V Subscriber
Jun 24, 2005
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#30
Had Trump not done that, there would be at least 2-million more jobs in green industry than the entire US oil industry. .
You can create a zillion jobs in any industry if you throw enough taxpayer money at it. It's called buying votes. It's always funny to me when people talk about looking to the rest of the world to copy their economic policies. That's like OU looking at the rest of the Big 12 to see how to improve in football.
 
Feb 6, 2007
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#31
The people who are actually making money off of wind PTCs are the banks and investment funds who are buying the tax credits. The PTCs sunset this year, do you see development slowing down? Its actually still increasing, that means one of 2 things, either they "know" that the PTCs will be extended or they feel that they can continue growing without them. You can believe whatever you want to, but the reality on the ground is that Wind and solar are winning because they are becoming the low cost alternative, will they get us to a 100% greenhouse gas free world, probably not, but every wind farm that is put up gets us a bit closer, just like every btu produced by natural gas instead of coal gets us a bit closer. I would suggest reading the book "More from Less", the US is much closer to carbon neutrality than you may realize.
You are completely ignoring the industrial processes and mining of steel and other minerals necessary for the manufacture of components for "green energy" capture devices. You obsess about carbon neutrality while others take your money (directly and indirectly). It's more about transfer of wealth than it is about environmental responsibility. Atmospheric CO2 levels were exponentially higher during the last ice age than they are today.
 
Aug 16, 2012
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#32
It boggles my mind how the Republican party has zero interest in green technology. Obama paved the way for green technology that would've had an impact of at least(!!) $2 trillion dollars. Of course, here comes the knuckle-dragging Donald "The Chump' Trump issuing executive order to literally eliminate every single green technology policy Obama's administration successfully implemented. Had Trump not done that, there would be at least 2-million more jobs in green industry than the entire US oil industry. Trump basically set us back to the 1900's. And guess who the world turned to, instead of the US because of Trump? You guessed it.. China. Trump literally robbed our economy of trillions of dollars and handed it to China. What God damn fool Trump and the Republican party truly are.

Whilst the rest of the world have invested heavily in transforming their carbon infrastructure into green infrastructure, Trump literally destroyed any hope the US ever had in transforming our crumbling infrastructure. And y'all are were just a-okau with that. I mean, Trump used "I'll rebuild our infrastructure," which obviously was a flat-out lie. Instead, Trump GUARANTEED our crumbling infrastructure would remain steadfast in its deterioration! Y'all love propaganda, for some reason
The Republican party is a god damn disease upon this country. Good job, all you Republicans. Give yourselves a 'round of applause, champs. Stop voting against green technology, and setting us back countless decades.

And why did Trump do that? To win the state of Pennsylvania during election time. What a fool.
Cannot believe that you fell for the bogus numbers. Green is simply a money maker for a select few.

We used to do green reviews of apartments for Freddie and Fannie. They stopped. The whole program was a waste. People would refi or purchase with green incentives, swap out incandescent lamps and cash a huge check that was meant to also cover new HVAC, water fixtures and windows. But the most amazing, Freddie/Fannie never even had assessors look at the obvious....attic insulation which on old buildings, is antiquated rock wool compacted thinner than the truss chords. Easy improvement that was completely ignored.
 
Aug 16, 2012
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#33
have you had out of the ordinary rate increases on your power bill in the last 5 years? because wind has gone from <5% penetration to 30% average and 70% maximum in that time. They would not be investing a billion dollars in wind turbines in Oklahoma if they could not compete in the energy market.
Wind is not without its problems. I had no idea the turbine blades had such a short useful life.
1583788202972.png

https://www.americanexperiment.org/2019/08/wind-turbine-landfill-mass-grave-report-decide/

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/feat...be-recycled-so-they-re-piling-up-in-landfills
 
Feb 6, 2007
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Ardmore, Ok.
#34
The people who are actually making money off of wind PTCs are the banks and investment funds who are buying the tax credits. The PTCs sunset this year, do you see development slowing down? Its actually still increasing, that means one of 2 things, either they "know" that the PTCs will be extended or they feel that they can continue growing without them. You can believe whatever you want to, but the reality on the ground is that Wind and solar are winning because they are becoming the low cost alternative, will they get us to a 100% greenhouse gas free world, probably not, but every wind farm that is put up gets us a bit closer, just like every btu produced by natural gas instead of coal gets us a bit closer. I would suggest reading the book "More from Less", the US is much closer to carbon neutrality than you may realize.
Or, it could be that they are "banking" on enough sheeple to buy into their propaganda that it becomes a "reality" by the will of the masses. It's not that I am against "green" energy; it is that I believe the only things that are truly sustainable are those that are economically profitable . . . without subsidy biases.
 
Nov 16, 2013
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tractor
#36
Wind is NOT significant, it's mostly built out, and the generators that currently exist are aging and need replacing.

View attachment 78161

View attachment 78162
It's a a decent peak generation supplement. Most of the generated wind energy is bought by corporations for advertisements reasons. Theres a reason Google parks their server farms by natural gas generation plants
 

Jostate

CPTNQUIRK called me a greenhorn
A/V Subscriber
Jun 24, 2005
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#38
Sep 22, 2011
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#39
FAR too many of them are. Both sides do it. Again, it's called buying votes, and I'm opposed to it. There may be exceptions where I could be sold on the idea, but I would rather not use my tax dollars to buy votes or pick and choose favorites of the latest political wind.
Im down to get rid of them all, but that is not a popular opinion with anyone in power, or the general public, everyone hates all of the subsidies except the ones that benefit them and will fight tooth and nail for those
 
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