Basketball Team Expectations

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OSUMIKE17

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I agree with the "fit" aspect of Keylan and Flavors. But those two guys just aren't as talented as the others in my opinion. So, Boynton will have a fit vs talent battle going on in his head a lot.
I suppose this depends on your definition of talent. I’d say that having the ability to put the ball in the net from range at a clip of 38% or higher is a talent that not many guys on our team have.

Now, are Keylan and Flavors as talented in other areas as some of the players such as driving or passing? Absolutely not.

But there’s a balance to be had there so that all parties can play off of each other in order to fully maximize the talents they do have.
 

RutherfordFan

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Having Cunningham will be a game changer, both next year and for the future. He'll make us competitive next year and put us back on the map. He'll also (barring anything crazy) be a top 3 draft pick, and get us a ton of great publicity which will help with high profile recruits.
He'll be #1 draft pick and I agree. He'll change everything for us. It's only upward from here for the basketball program.
 
Sep 23, 2010
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I suppose this depends on your definition of talent. I’d say that having the ability to put the ball in the net from range at a clip of 38% or higher is a talent that not many guys on our team have.

Now, are Keylan and Flavors as talented in other areas as some of the players such as driving or passing? Absolutely not.

But there’s a balance to be had there so that all parties can play off of each other in order to fully maximize the talents they do have.
My definition of talent would include skill, but I can shoot the ball almost better than all these guys. Unfortunately, I'm only 6'2, I am very slow and vertically challenged.

Cunningham, Kalib, Moncrieff.....these guys have the most God-Given athletic talent on the team. They have the best athletic ability that could be translated to the NBA. Next tier in talent goes to Ice, AA, Walker, Yor. Next tier of talent would go to Williams, Harris, Keylan, Flavors, Pena...Then there is Hiddie. Just my opinions. I think they can all be good to solid Big 12 players.

People are all excited for Flavors. But we must remember that he's played at 3 different schools and none of them are near big 12 caliber, not even midmajor caliber really. Guys are going to be closing out faster to him with better length than he's ever seen. And he will have to be able to defend at this level as well. And Keylan probably doesn't get recruited at a Big 12 level if he's not twins with Kalib. I think they can both help us in some ways, and I hate to make it sound like I am down on them. I am not. Reality is, Keylan and Flavors would have a heck of time getting any shot off versus elite defenders. But you team them with a Cade and an Ice, now they can stand in the corner and make defenders make a choice to help or stay. That is where the fit part will come into play.
 

OSU79

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My definition of talent would include skill, but I can shoot the ball almost better than all these guys. Unfortunately, I'm only 6'2, I am very slow and vertically challenged.

Cunningham, Kalib, Moncrieff.....these guys have the most God-Given athletic talent on the team. They have the best athletic ability that could be translated to the NBA. Next tier in talent goes to Ice, AA, Walker, Yor. Next tier of talent would go to Williams, Harris, Keylan, Flavors, Pena...Then there is Hiddie. Just my opinions. I think they can all be good to solid Big 12 players.

People are all excited for Flavors. But we must remember that he's played at 3 different schools and none of them are near big 12 caliber, not even midmajor caliber really. Guys are going to be closing out faster to him with better length than he's ever seen. And he will have to be able to defend at this level as well. And Keylan probably doesn't get recruited at a Big 12 level if he's not twins with Kalib. I think they can both help us in some ways, and I hate to make it sound like I am down on them. I am not. Reality is, Keylan and Flavors would have a heck of time getting any shot off versus elite defenders. But you team them with a Cade and an Ice, now they can stand in the corner and make defenders make a choice to help or stay. That is where the fit part will come into play.
It's not that I disagree with your evaluations, but I think Ice will also be a solid NBA guy, though he may also spend some time in the D (G?) league until his shooting improves. I used to play with a guy who watched osu but wasn't a real "fan." He was always asking me if I thought Marcus Smart would make it in the NBA. I said absolutely he would, because he was physically imposing, even at 6'4". I feel the same about Ice - he came into college with a man's body (no homo) and will be able to defend and rebound with NBA guys. It will buy him some time to improve his offense.
 

OSUMIKE17

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My definition of talent would include skill, but I can shoot the ball almost better than all these guys. Unfortunately, I'm only 6'2, I am very slow and vertically challenged.
I’m talking about shooting in game situations. Even at the level of Flavors in his prior stops, that’s asking a whole lot more than you just standing alone on the perimeter or running a pickup game at a local gym.
Cunningham, Kalib, Moncrieff.....these guys have the most God-Given athletic talent on the team. They have the best athletic ability that could be translated to the NBA.
I’m with you here although I think Keylan could jump into this level. I think he’s much more athletic than you’re giving him credit for. He was a top 3 prospect in Oklahoma for a reason.
Next tier in talent goes to Ice, AA, Walker, Yor.
This gets muddy because I really think there’s a difference between athleticism and talent and it seems they’re being interchanged from here on down.
Next tier of talent would go to Williams, Harris, Keylan, Flavors, Pena...Then there is Hiddie. Just my opinions. I think they can all be good to solid Big 12 players.

People are all excited for Flavors. But we must remember that he's played at 3 different schools and none of them are near big 12 caliber, not even midmajor caliber really. Guys are going to be closing out faster to him with better length than he's ever seen. And he will have to be able to defend at this level as well.
If this were a year without Cunningham and Ice, I may share this concern but I think he’s going to get his fair share of open looks even if you are worried about the level he played at previously. On defense, we’ll see.
And Keylan probably doesn't get recruited at a Big 12 level if he's not twins with Kalib. I think they can both help us in some ways, and I hate to make it sound like I am down on them. I am not. Reality is, Keylan and Flavors would have a heck of time getting any shot off versus elite defenders. But you team them with a Cade and an Ice, now they can stand in the corner and make defenders make a choice to help or stay. That is where the fit part will come into play.
I don’t understand this assumption regarding Keylan getting a shot off against elite defenders. He already proved last season in very limited time that he can hit shots. 35% from three as a true freshman is pretty damn good. He’s only going to get better from there.
 

OSUMIKE17

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Playing 3 guards without a shooter is no worse than playing a couple of Seniors last year that couldn’t play a lick of defense.


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...that doesn’t exactly prove a good point about playing three guards without a shooter.
 

NinjaPoke

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1. #1 in Big 12 overall in season.
2. Big 12 tournament winner.
3. Over all #3 in national ranking (#2 going to UK and #1 Duke) with a top seeded ranking going to the dance.
4. Sweep against KU.

I think I’m right in at least of those dreams
 
Sep 23, 2010
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I don’t understand this assumption regarding Keylan getting a shot off against elite defenders. He already proved last season in very limited time that he can hit shots. 35% from three as a true freshman is pretty damn good. He’s only going to get better from there.
Yeah, you could very well be right about Keylan. I am looking at him in the eyes of scout, and maybe I should be looking at him as what he can provide to this team. His sample size was small last season. I can't remember if he got hurt, but he only played in 13 of the 18 conference games at 7min/game. And in conference he went 5/12 from 3.

Coach liked him early and waned off of him a bit. His development would be huge for our team as he would provide us an interchangeable guy who could play 2-4. If he's getting stronger this offseason and becomes a better defender, he can become a valuable catch and shoot 3 guy and crash the offensive glass.
 

OSUMIKE17

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Yeah, you could very well be right about Keylan. I am looking at him in the eyes of scout, and maybe I should be looking at him as what he can provide to this team. His sample size was small last season. I can't remember if he got hurt, but he only played in 13 of the 18 conference games at 7min/game. And in conference he went 5/12 from 3.

Coach liked him early and waned off of him a bit. His development would be huge for our team as he would provide us an interchangeable guy who could play 2-4. If he's getting stronger this offseason and becomes a better defender, he can become a valuable catch and shoot 3 guy and crash the offensive glass.
I think Coach didn’t like his defensive effort/understanding. The few times I saw him get onto Keylan was right after a defensive possession. I think that’s where he needs to improve in order to see meaningful minutes. I’ll take that 41% three point conference mark all season long, please.

And yeah, I’m definitely looking at this through the eyes of what he can do for the team rather than an NBA scout. Phil Forte was never going to be an NBA player but who wouldn’t love to have him starting at the 2 next season?
 
Sep 23, 2010
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Unless Likekele turns himself into a guy who make a jump shot he’ll never play a minute in the NBA.
I agree. Ice will become a very good college player. Ice is good at everything beside shooting, but he is not elite at one thing, which will be required for him to make the league. The league needs specialists to build around their superstars.