Barr affirms Mueller found no evidence of Trump-Russia collusion; report release at 11 a.m.

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Jul 25, 2018
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Sorry, just noticed you had a question at the end there. I don't see how in the world you'd ever answer a question like "knew all along that there was never any collusion", but what I would like to see is a bipartisan look at the whole FISA process and a revamp if needed. IMO if you have a problem with how any of this started, it has to be with the FISA process.
Completely agree, but I'm afraid I'll win the PowerBall before we see anything resembling bipartisan here.

The whole genesis of this thing ought to be of concern for anyone, regardless of party, just like the Clinton investigation.

How a paid for piece of opposition research can be passed off to the Intel community & then pursued limitlessly without a real hard look & who's presenting it & what their motivations for doing so might be is dirty, dirty business.
 
Nov 6, 2010
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Completely agree, but I'm afraid I'll win the PowerBall before we see anything resembling bipartisan here.

The whole genesis of this thing ought to be of concern for anyone, regardless of party, just like the Clinton investigation.

How a paid for piece of opposition research can be passed off to the Intel community & then pursued limitlessly without a real hard look & who's presenting it & what their motivations for doing so might be is dirty, dirty business.
I know that's the narrative, but I don't think that's entirely true. The Australian tip about Carter Page was a big part of it, and that was absolutely legit IMO. I have no doubt the Russians were trying to cultivate him into an asset, not because he was willing, but because he was stupid. And there is where it gets sticky with the FISA stuff and counter intelligence in general. I'm sure if any of this had happened during the cold war era we'd have never heard about it. They'd have let Page get cozy and then use him to plant disinformation, or some such. I fear since we declared victory in that thing, we've gotten lazy and clumsy, and Russia has gotten more subtle.
 
Jul 25, 2018
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I know that's the narrative, but I don't think that's entirely true. The Australian tip about Carter Page was a big part of it, and that was absolutely legit IMO. I have no doubt the Russians were trying to cultivate him into an asset, not because he was willing, but because he was stupid. And there is where it gets sticky with the FISA stuff and counter intelligence in general. I'm sure if any of this had happened during the cold war era we'd have never heard about it. They'd have let Page get cozy and then use him to plant disinformation, or some such. I fear since we declared victory in that thing, we've gotten lazy and clumsy, and Russia has gotten more subtle.
Which brings us to China & 5G technology.

The development of a "space force" has taken plenty of barbs, but imo, we're either gonna be proactive on this front or reactive, & I prefer the former.

As for the Aussie:

"The Australian diplomat whose tip in 2016 prompted the Russia-Trump investigation previously arranged one of the largest foreign donations to Bill and Hillary Clinton’s charitable efforts, documents show.

Former Australian Foreign Minister Alexander Downer’s role in securing $25 million in aid from his country to help the Clinton Foundation fight AIDS is chronicled in decade-old government memos archived on the Australian foreign ministry’s website.

Downer and former President Clinton jointly signed a Memorandum of Understanding in February 2006 that spread out the grant money over four years for a project to provide screening and drug treatment to AIDS patients in Asia. "

"Downer, now Australia’s ambassador to London, provided the account of a conversation with Trump campaign adviser George Papadopoulos at a London bar in 2016 that became the official reason the FBI opened the Russia counterintelligence probe.


But lawmakers say the FBI didn’t tell Congress about Downer’s prior connection to the Clinton Foundation. Republicans say they are concerned the new information means nearly all of the early evidence the FBI used to justify its election-year probe of Trump came from sources supportive of the Clintons, including the controversial Steele dossier."
 
Nov 6, 2010
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Which brings us to China & 5G technology.

The development of a "space force" has taken plenty of barbs, but imo, we're either gonna be proactive on this front or reactive, & I prefer the former.

As for the Aussie:

"The Australian diplomat whose tip in 2016 prompted the Russia-Trump investigation previously arranged one of the largest foreign donations to Bill and Hillary Clinton’s charitable efforts, documents show.

Former Australian Foreign Minister Alexander Downer’s role in securing $25 million in aid from his country to help the Clinton Foundation fight AIDS is chronicled in decade-old government memos archived on the Australian foreign ministry’s website.

Downer and former President Clinton jointly signed a Memorandum of Understanding in February 2006 that spread out the grant money over four years for a project to provide screening and drug treatment to AIDS patients in Asia. "

"Downer, now Australia’s ambassador to London, provided the account of a conversation with Trump campaign adviser George Papadopoulos at a London bar in 2016 that became the official reason the FBI opened the Russia counterintelligence probe.


But lawmakers say the FBI didn’t tell Congress about Downer’s prior connection to the Clinton Foundation. Republicans say they are concerned the new information means nearly all of the early evidence the FBI used to justify its election-year probe of Trump came from sources supportive of the Clintons, including the controversial Steele dossier."

I think the space force thing is semantics, it just sounds silly. But we do need to get NASA back on track. Quit building aircraft carriers and invest in the future.

https://www.cnn.com/videos/us/2019/05/24/nasa-plans-to-return-to-the-moon-orig-tc.cnn/video/playlists/moon-space/
 

SLVRBK

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I know that's the narrative, but I don't think that's entirely true. The Australian tip about Carter Page was a big part of it, and that was absolutely legit IMO. I have no doubt the Russians were trying to cultivate him into an asset, not because he was willing, but because he was stupid. And there is where it gets sticky with the FISA stuff and counter intelligence in general. I'm sure if any of this had happened during the cold war era we'd have never heard about it. They'd have let Page get cozy and then use him to plant disinformation, or some such. I fear since we declared victory in that thing, we've gotten lazy and clumsy, and Russia has gotten more subtle.
Which brings us to China & 5G technology.

The development of a "space force" has taken plenty of barbs, but imo, we're either gonna be proactive on this front or reactive, & I prefer the former.

As for the Aussie:

"The Australian diplomat whose tip in 2016 prompted the Russia-Trump investigation previously arranged one of the largest foreign donations to Bill and Hillary Clinton’s charitable efforts, documents show.

Former Australian Foreign Minister Alexander Downer’s role in securing $25 million in aid from his country to help the Clinton Foundation fight AIDS is chronicled in decade-old government memos archived on the Australian foreign ministry’s website.

Downer and former President Clinton jointly signed a Memorandum of Understanding in February 2006 that spread out the grant money over four years for a project to provide screening and drug treatment to AIDS patients in Asia. "

"Downer, now Australia’s ambassador to London, provided the account of a conversation with Trump campaign adviser George Papadopoulos at a London bar in 2016 that became the official reason the FBI opened the Russia counterintelligence probe.


But lawmakers say the FBI didn’t tell Congress about Downer’s prior connection to the Clinton Foundation. Republicans say they are concerned the new information means nearly all of the early evidence the FBI used to justify its election-year probe of Trump came from sources supportive of the Clintons, including the controversial Steele dossier."
@gundysburner thanks for posting that, my memory was that the Aussie tip was in regards to Papadopoulos...that is part of the situation under the IG investigation. IIRC, Papadopoulos states he learned the info from Setfan Halper who is a CIA asset in the UK or the mysterious Joseph Misfund who Halper set him up with.
 

SLVRBK

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I think the space force thing is semantics, it just sounds silly. But we do need to get NASA back on track. Quit building aircraft carriers and invest in the future.

https://www.cnn.com/videos/us/2019/05/24/nasa-plans-to-return-to-the-moon-orig-tc.cnn/video/playlists/moon-space/
Not really most reports are that Russia and China are ahead of us in space based weapons...satellite killers.
 
Nov 6, 2010
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Not really most reports are that Russia and China are ahead of us in space based weapons...satellite killers.
Whether or not that's true, I'm still talking about the name not the substance. I think this kind of stuff from a defense standpoint has always been organized up through the air force. Not sure why that would need to change and create a whole new branch of the military, but I'm no expert.
 

SLVRBK

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Whether or not that's true, I'm still talking about the name not the substance. I think this kind of stuff from a defense standpoint has always been organized up through the air force. Not sure why that would need to change and create a whole new branch of the military, but I'm no expert.
Frankly, it's to give it equal footing as the other branches. The AF is deciding whether to spend it's budget on planes, bombs, drones and space...the Space Force will be focused on 1 area.
 
Jul 25, 2018
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Whether or not that's true, I'm still talking about the name not the substance. I think this kind of stuff from a defense standpoint has always been organized up through the air force. Not sure why that would need to change and create a whole new branch of the military, but I'm no expert.
You're exactly right. The coverage of the guffaws about a "space force" is just another example of creating headlines for attention, while virtually ignoring the substance behind what's being proposed.
 

CocoCincinnati

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Sorry, just noticed you had a question at the end there. I don't see how in the world you'd ever answer a question like "knew all along that there was never any collusion", but what I would like to see is a bipartisan look at the whole FISA process and a revamp if needed. IMO if you have a problem with how any of this started, it has to be with the FISA process.
I understand the reason behind the FISA law and my only problem with it is the fear that it can be abused by the federal government. In other words, no it's not the FISA process that I have the biggest problem with, it's the willingness by government officials to ignore that process for political purposes. If it can be proven that the Obama administration did in fact abuse this law then I would say the whole FISA system needs to go away. Certainly the Dems wouldn't want Trump using FISA to spy on whoever wins the Dem primary, so it's best to just remove the temptation from Turmp and all future presidents completely.

The ultimate irony of course, is that by getting rid of FISA, we really WILL make it easier for foreign entities to hack us in the future. Just one more long term unintended consequences that the left doesn't seem to realize could arise from their actions (which they claim is to prevent future hacking).
 
Nov 6, 2010
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I understand the reason behind the FISA law and my only problem with it is the fear that it can be abused by the federal government. In other words, no it's not the FISA process that I have the biggest problem with, it's the willingness by government officials to ignore that process for political purposes. If it can be proven that the Obama administration did in fact abuse this law then I would say the whole FISA system needs to go away. Certainly the Dems wouldn't want Trump using FISA to spy on whoever wins the Dem primary, so it's best to just remove the temptation from Turmp and all future presidents completely.

The ultimate irony of course, is that by getting rid of FISA, we really WILL make it easier for foreign entities to hack us in the future. Just one more long term unintended consequences that the left doesn't seem to realize could arise from their actions (which they claim is to prevent future hacking).
There is no way we cut out the entire apparatus. More stringent requirements or something probably, but without the ability to monitor US citizens communications with foreign entities, 9/11 happens again within a year.
 

CocoCincinnati

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There is no way we cut out the entire apparatus. More stringent requirements or something probably, but without the ability to monitor US citizens communications with foreign entities, 9/11 happens again within a year.
Which just makes it all the more appalling if we find out somebody did abuse the law purely for political reasons and why such a person or people should face severe penalties for doing so.
 
Nov 6, 2010
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Which just makes it all the more appalling if we find out somebody did abuse the law purely for political reasons and why such a person or people should face severe penalties for doing so.
Yea, but I don't think you're going to see that. Regardless of what you believe/think, thankfully, it has to be proven. Just like with the obstruction stuff from the Mueller report. You COULD say it was there, but it's just not enough to prosecute. I hope the bar remains high in that sense. We as a country don't need to go down that path of prosecuting every former administration for whatever infraction the other side can dream up.
 

Cowboy2U

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Yea, but I don't think you're going to see that. Regardless of what you believe/think, thankfully, it has to be proven. Just like with the obstruction stuff from the Mueller report. You COULD say it was there, but it's just not enough to prosecute. I hope the bar remains high in that sense. We as a country don't need to go down that path of prosecuting every former administration for whatever infraction the other side can dream up.
We shouldn't prosecute for an well orchestrated coup attempt? What freakin infractions do you consider prosecutable worthy? Does it have to be a pistol to the head... these scum deserve everything coming to them unless we allow schiff to chair the trial. hrc, bo and his dirty little group deserve long prison sentences if convicted. And, unless they let hillary burn the emails and correspondence then they will be convicted. Apparently you know more than the Atty General does...
 

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Rep. Jerry Nadler had what is being called a "medical crisis" today during an event for Mayor deBlasio, kind if f worried the stress is getting to him
 

Cowboy2U

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Rep. Jerry Nadler had what is being called a "medical crisis" today during an event for Mayor deBlasio, kind if f worried the stress is getting to him
Just another one of the turds waiting for the toilet to flush. In addition his left eyebrow is really a misplaced fake mustache, somebody help this fool.
 

swamppoke

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I know that's the narrative, but I don't think that's entirely true. The Australian tip about Carter Page was a big part of it, and that was absolutely legit IMO. I have no doubt the Russians were trying to cultivate him into an asset, not because he was willing, but because he was stupid. And there is where it gets sticky with the FISA stuff and counter intelligence in general. I'm sure if any of this had happened during the cold war era we'd have never heard about it. They'd have let Page get cozy and then use him to plant disinformation, or some such. I fear since we declared victory in that thing, we've gotten lazy and clumsy, and Russia has gotten more subtle.
Carter Page graduated in the top 10% of his class at Annapolis. He is not "stupid". He also served as an Naval Intelligence Officer, so he's not naive, either. As for the legitimacy of the Aussie tip; I think that's been covered. I'm confused about what "we declared victory in that thing". :confused:
 
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Cowboy2U

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Carter Page graduated in the top 10% of his class at Annapolis. He is not "stupid". He also served as an Naval Intelligence Officer, so he's not naive, either. As for the legitimacy of the Aussie tip; I think that's been covered. I'm confused about what "we declared victory in that thing". :confused:
Wanna see stupid...oac is dumb as a box of rocks and that's offensive to the rocks.