2020 election thread

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Apr 12, 2020
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Stillwater
came from a talk with senator lankford, he said that the tax cut was designed to be revenue neutral at 5% growth, which we never hit. As for the rich paying their fair share, the top 20% own 80% of the wealth in this country, and it has only gotten worse over the years, it is a recipe for disaster
And the top 20% of wage earners also pay 84% of federal income tax. At what point do you stop squeezing people that make money and instead look for spending cuts?

How much do you want to take from wage earners? 50%, 70%, 90%?
I mean, until Reagan 70% was the norm, well at least hypothetically, a lot easier to hide money back then (although the truly rich manage to do it well now). And increasing tax brackets still are heavily mitigated by being brackets.


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Rack

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I'm on the ethics board at a hospital that is partners with a Catholic hospital and by agreement generally follows Catholic ethics with respect to abortion. I can say beyond all shadows of a doubt that this procedure would have been allowed. It would have been discussed, but it would have been allowed.
Food for thought...

So, I know this little girl who just turned 5, she was partially "born" at 27 weeks while surgeons repaired her spine that was outside of her body. She was then placed back in her mothers womb and she was born again eight weeks later. Her mother was told to abort her baby by several medical people or that it might kill her and that her baby would never be "normal." The mother choose not too abort but rather to have a very difficult surgery and isolated birth. Now this little girl is at the little lighthouse graduating from kindergarten just last year and is an inspiration to many. She is nearly complete normal other than the walker she uses. She is a light to many people and a miracle child to me. She has brought comfort to a dyeing man who passed away a while ago of ALS who saw God's miracle in her as even further proof in that power transcending even after life. Her grandfather is a good friend of mine and a fantastic example of faith in his own right, but that's another post. His moto is "God's got this." I'm glad that she didn't listen to medical advice, and I'm sure her little girl is as well. Because God had it, even when Medical Professionals told her he didn't.
 

steross

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Mar 31, 2004
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Food for thought...

So, I know this little girl who just turned 5, she was partially "born" at 27 weeks while surgeons repaired her spine that was outside of her body. She was then placed back in her mothers womb and she was born again eight weeks later. Her mother was told to abort her baby by several medical people or that it might kill her and that her baby would never be "normal." The mother choose not too abort but rather to have a very difficult surgery and isolated birth. Now this little girl is at the little lighthouse graduating from kindergarten just last year and is an inspiration to many. She is nearly complete normal other than the walker she uses. She is a light to many people and a miracle child to me. She has brought comfort to a dyeing man who passed away a while ago of ALS who saw God's miracle in her as even further proof in that power transcending even after life. Her grandfather is a good friend of mine and a fantastic example of faith in his own right, but that's another post. His moto is "God's got this." I'm glad that she didn't listen to medical advice, and I'm sure her little girl is as well. Because God had it, even when Medical Professionals told her he didn't.
So, you are saying that medical professionals, knowing that a surgery that could potentially repair this injury in the womb (they are not "born" in any way as the birth process creates many physiologic changes that did not occur during this surgery) but told a woman that did not want to abort to go ahead and abort anyway?

Why? That makes no sense other than to take a heartwarming story from heartwarming to political.

And, I really cringe at the stories where they say God's doing these things. As a medical professional, when people ask me why God didn't do their miracle, what is my answer after they read stories like this?
 
Sep 22, 2011
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And the top 20% of wage earners also pay 84% of federal income tax. At what point do you stop squeezing people that make money and instead look for spending cuts?

How much do you want to take from wage earners? 50%, 70%, 90%?
I am no tax expert but here is what I will say, what do you think the mob will take from you when the pitchforks come out? I say that knowing as an upper middle class earner I will be first on the chopping block of the mob because I cant afford the security measures or escape routes that others can.
 

oldguy

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Sep 12, 2008
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Michael Moore starting to panic..

"Check this out—during the same week in August, but 4yrs apart: In 2016, Hillary was way ahead of Trump. But this past week, in some swing states, Biden’s lead is less than what Hillary’s was. You can’t blame this one on the PO or Russia. This is on the candidate & party. WAKE UP!"


 

RxCowboy

Has no Rx for his orange obsession.
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So, you are saying that medical professionals, knowing that a surgery that could potentially repair this injury in the womb (they are not "born" in any way as the birth process creates many physiologic changes that did not occur during this surgery) but told a woman that did not want to abort to go ahead and abort anyway?

Why? That makes no sense other than to take a heartwarming story from heartwarming to political.

And, I really cringe at the stories where they say God's doing these things. As a medical professional, when people ask me why God didn't do their miracle, what is my answer after they read stories like this?
It's glurge that has absolutely nothing to do with the scenario we were discussing.

I am adamantly pro-life.
 

OSUCowboy787

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It’s a bit hyperbolic, IMHO. But I do think Trump has a blatant disregard for the constitution and pretty much uses the judicial system as a tool for his personal gain. I think he’ll take every inch he can can get despite the ethics or legality, as long as he feels protected from being convicted. I don’t think he’s stupid, but he is a narcissist at the least. So, I absolutely do not trust him.

I’m concerned with what he would do with the power he would have without another election to temper him at all. But I’m most concerned with the precedents he would set and the repercussions they could have with future presidents Republican or Democrat. Obama took things too far with executive orders and expanding the powers of the executive branch. Trump has made that look like child’s play in his first term. What would that mean for our democracy in his second term? Beyond that?

The question then becomes whether Biden would be any different. I don’t know. I can’t imagine he would be as egregious as Trump. But maybe the presidency is the One Ring to Rule Them All, and we are without a trustworthy hobbit.
Hunter Biden says hello.
Old Joe will do whatever he can to help himself and his coke head son etc. Don't believe for a second either of these men won't, no matter who wins.
 

TheMonkey

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LOL, only a bit hyperbolic huh. Your first two paragraphs could apply to pretty much every politician in DC. It cracks me up the number of people that think anyone in DC has given a flying flip about the constitution in quite some time.

The only real difference between Trump and the rest is that apparently the establishment of both parties don't like him, which IMO makes it harder to get away with things that a person in good standing with one or both parties could.

As to your 3rd paragraph, we don't have to wonder about Biden. He's been in politics for 40 years....he and all of his family are multi multi millionaires as a result. He is a major member in the political elite that has been screwing us over for decades...its people like Biden and Pelosi and McConnell that led to someone like Trump being able to be elected in the first place....why go back to what we already rejected as bad... we'll just end up with another Trump 10 years down the road and this time he might actually be a wannabe dictator.
Hunter Biden says hello.
Old Joe will do whatever he can to help himself and his coke head son etc. Don't believe for a second either of these men won't, no matter who wins.
Generalizing is fun. If I get pulled over by a cop and say, “Yeah, everybody speeds.” That should not get me off the hook. Also, nice that there are no specifics here.
 

Rack

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So, you are saying that medical professionals, knowing that a surgery that could potentially repair this injury in the womb (they are not "born" in any way as the birth process creates many physiologic changes that did not occur during this surgery) but told a woman that did not want to abort to go ahead and abort anyway?

Why? That makes no sense other than to take a heartwarming story from heartwarming to political.

And, I really cringe at the stories where they say God's doing these things. As a medical professional, when people ask me why God didn't do their miracle, what is my answer after they read stories like this?
"Some" medical professionals advised against, others provided hope. That's why she choose them over those that didn't. She had to go to Nashville and do this...spent a ton of time in isolation and gave birth while on the phone with her husband. I don't know all the details, just the overall joy that the child brought.

As far as dealing with death of a patient. Wow. I really don't know...I would say that we don't say much of anything...just be there and give them a big hug. We shut our mouths and open our arms. I do have faith however that God cares for all of us, both born an unborn, in life and in death, and that it's actually better on the other side. I KNOW you care, and KNOW you want to save lives. I'm honestly so glad that I don't do what you do. Reality is harsh and our faith comes from our personal experiences...not necessarily what others would see as "reality" or "scientific." I've told you my personal experiences with near death...I don't have the answer for why some stay and some go. I just trust there is a good reason God thought it was time for them to come home despite our efforts. That's faith.

1 Corinthians 13:12 12For now we see through a glass, darkly; but then face to face: now I know in part; but then shall I know even as also I am known.
 
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OSUCowboy787

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Rack

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It's glurge that has absolutely nothing to do with the scenario we were discussing.

I am adamantly pro-life.
I didn't say you weren't. I just didn't totally understood the scenario/situation. I know that you would want to save both the mother AND the baby if possible. I was just giving an example of when both were possible but not advised by some in the medical profession. NOT all in the medical profession as she did do surgery and deliver a baby with a corrected spine. I'll have to find a more complete description of the story, I didn't do it justice. It's certainly uplifting...That was my intention.
 

RxCowboy

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I didn't say you weren't. I just didn't totally understood the scenario/situation. I know that you would want to save both the mother AND the baby if possible. I was just giving an example of when both were possible but not advised by some in the medical profession. NOT all in the medical profession as she did do surgery and deliver a baby with a corrected spine. I'll have to find a more complete description of the story, I didn't do it justice. It's certainly uplifting...That was my intention.
In the scenario the @steross described, saving the life of the mother was the only option. My comment means that it would have been considered ethically permissible even under the most conservative ethics, Catholic ethics. The purpose of your story was to introduce an emotional component, essentially an argument from emotion. Neither of us would deny that it is an emotionally excruciating decision, but it doesn't help in the case that we were discussing.
 
Feb 7, 2007
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how is naming hunter biden specifically, generalities? unless you are fully unread on all current events you know he has benefited from morally questionable/borderline illegal nepotism,

https://www.ocregister.com/2020/01/18/hunter-biden-and-the-perennial-problem-of-political-nepotism/
I look forward to nepotism laws becoming a thing GOP cares about after the SIL and Daughter of the president have been on White House staff for the last 4 years.

Also they will probably care when a Dem president hosts a campaign rally at the white house.
 

OSUCowboy787

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I look forward to nepotism laws becoming a thing GOP cares about after the SIL and Daughter of the president have been on White House staff for the last 4 years.

Also they will probably care when a Dem president hosts a campaign rally and the white house.
In my first message i literally said both men have done and will continue to do this.
 

Rack

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In the scenario the @steross described, saving the life of the mother was the only option. My comment means that it would have been considered ethically permissible even under the most conservative ethics, Catholic ethics. The purpose of your story was to introduce an emotional component, essentially an argument from emotion. Neither of us would deny that it is an emotionally excruciating decision, but it doesn't help in the case that we were discussing.
I simply don't understand why you would recommend that be done at the Catholic Hospital when I'm sure many others would provide the service. I believe in an outside power that is greater and so do they at the Catholic Hospital, and so do you. So when a procedure will end one life to save another it is still ending one life....why wouldn't you recommend that be done elsewhere? In his scenario he noted that others had advised a different approach that "wouldn't have worked"....I'm not making a judgement on if that approach was viable as I don't have that knowledge AT ALL, but a faith based institution shouldn't make a choice to end any life. So the ethical faith based decision would be to send her somewhere else. That's my opinion based in my faith experience, not emotions. Plus it just doesn't make any sense for a faith based institution to put themselves in a position that COULD put them at odds with those who support it. Not only would that be ethically wrong, it would be a financial mistake.
 
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